My Debate On JFK On The Mythbusters Forum - OMFG!!!!!

[turtleman]

I have been following Wim's forum for several years sifting through the posts and reading the contents page. I stayed away from posting as some of you all have such deep knowledge of the assassination that I really never felt worthy of engaging. I have been fascinated for most of my life with JFK's murder and the ensuing cover up. So I notice Pasquale is in a bit of a fix over there on the Mythbuster forum. Under some serious triangulation and just getting hit from all angles. The simpletons over there were so caught up in nuanced detail they really lost track of the big picture. So I registered and wrote a piece laying out the landscape leading up to 11/22/63. Well here is what I wrote;I have followed this thread for a few days and am stymied by the number of people that think Oswald acted alone. When you examine the body of evidence as a whole there is little doubt we had elements within our own government conspiring with organized crime to remove a president who was not popular with this group of power brokers. Set aside what you know about what the Warren Commission spoon fed the public and look at the array of power that needed for the liberal Kennedy to be replaced by a more conservative Johnson.> The Mafia: Bobby Kennedy as acting Attorney General was waging a war on organized crime across the country. He was also disrupting the anti Castro training camps the CIA was organizing for overthrowing the Cuban government. The mob also had major gambling interests in Cuba that were shut down when Castro rose to power. The oil industry and precious metals that were being exploited by American interests also ceased leaving many heavy hitters hung out to dry when Castro took over. These were very powerful people who were very well connected.> The CIA: Kennedy had disgraced the CIA by not providing air support during the Bay of Pigs resulting in a miserable defeat and major embarrassment. And he wanted to normalize relations with Cuba after the missile crisis was resolved. This resulted in Kennedy proclaiming he was going to break the Allen Dulles directed CIA into a thousand pieces. Dulles was fired. Only to resurface on the Warren Commission. The CIA was also deeply entrenched into the Vietnam conflict which was not yet a war. Kennedy had signed executive orders to pull out of Vietnam. This did not sit well with the "Cold War Machine", the CIA, Joint Chiefs, and the all powerful defense industry could not have this Massachusetts liberal pulling the plug on the Vietnam conflict that they stood to profit from for years to come. LBJ would give them the war they wanted. And boy did he. How about that Gulf of Tonkin? Kennedy had to be removed.> The anti Castro Cubans were favs of the CIA and despised Kennedy for his wavering support during the Bay of Pigs. These Cubans some of which are known terrorists and were used by the "Agency" for everything from Central American coups to the infamous Watergate break in. They resurface time after time since the '60's and seem to enjoy and incredible level of protection by our government and to this day many of these known criminals still walk the streets of Miami. Is there any wonder why the Cubans are the only Hispanic faction faithful to the Republican Party? The Cubans that made it here are devoutly anti Castro. They never forgave Kennedy or the Democratic party for the Bay of Pigs.If you really have the time and curiosity there are not that many pieces of the jig saw puzzle left to put into place. Too many powers at be stood to lose too much with Kennedy in office. All the players were in Dealy Plaza that fateful day. The rogue elements of the CIA (Sturgis, Hunt, Phillips). Weren't those guys involved in Watergate too? The Cubans were there as well as the Mob. There is a man named James Files sitting in prison at Stateville in Illinois who has confessed to being the shooter on the grassy knoll that actually fired the lethal round that killed Kennedy. This man is the genuine article. He worked for Roselli and Nicolletti (also in Dallas)under Chicago crime boss Sam Giancana. When the Roselli and Nicolleti were to testify before the House Select Committe on Assasinations both died mysterious deaths shortly before testifying. Add them to the numerous list of dead that knew too much. And if you really want to see what your government was up to in the Summer of '63 check out Ed Haslam's "Dr. Mary's Monkey." It is an account of Oswald's activity working for the CIA and the bizarre goings on in New Orleans involving a clandestine program to eliminate Castro and how Oswald had been prepared to take the fall for the killing of the president. Judyth Vary Baker is among the players who put the whole operation into perspective. Look it up. Read a sample chapter. It will bend your mind. The thing that amazes me most is how they pulled off the cover up. It really worked for a long time but people near death have spoken out. Chauncey Holt, E. Howard Hunt, Tosh Plumlee, and James Files being some of the most notable. The amount of people close to the investigation who died mysterious deaths is way beyond coincidence. Way beyond. Nixon knew all about it. Listen to him talk about that "Bay of Pigs" thing to Halderman on tape. It is on youtube. It was Nixon who lost to Kennedy by a razor thin margin in 1960. Of course Nixon would not have beaten Bobby Kennedy in 1968 but we all know what happened to Bobby. Or do we? One might surmise that the "Right Wing" does not play nice. Maybe you are the type of person that just believes your government couldn't possibly be part of such a hideous crime. A coup 'de tat. Well we sure have staged enough of them abroad if you do your homework. What we had was the perfect storm of CIA, Mob, anti Castro dissidents, Texas oil, and defense industry power moguls pulling off the crime of the century. And a disinformation campaign that is relentless to this day. I guess the easiest thing to do is believe whatever you are told by your government and the corporate lobby. This is the same government that denies the existence of UFO's and employs scare tactics and fear mongering to bully the masses. The same government that gave you the war with Iraq, legalized torture, suspended Habeas Corpus, and warrantless wiretapping. Don't be sheeple. Gather the information and think for yourself. The pieces to the puzzle are there. And if you still think your government just couldn't do anything so heinous...Well I have a bridge I would like to sell you.And here is what showed up after it was flagged because of "key words."Turtleman5Junior MemberRegistered: 03-25-09 Posted 03-25-09 06:23 AM Hide PostReply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post I have followed this thread for a few days and am stymied by the number of people that think Oswald acted alone. When you examine the body of evidence as a whole there is little doubt we had elements within our own government conspiring with organized crime to remove a president who was not popular across this array of power brokers. Set aside what you know about what the Warren Commission spoon fed the public and look at the array of power that needed for the liberal Kennedy to be replaced by a more conservative Johnson.> The Mafia:> The CIA:> The anti Castro CubansAll the players were in Dealy Plaza that fateful day. The rogue element of the CIA. The Cubans were there as well as the Mob. There is a man named James Files sitting in prison at Stateville in Illinois who has confessed to being the shooter on the grassy knoll that actually fired the lethal round that killed Kennedy. When Roselli and Nicolleti were to testify before the House Select Committe on Assasinations both died mysterious deaths shortly before testifying.The thing that amazes me most is how they pulled off the cover up. It really worked for a long time but people near death have spoken out. Chauncey Holt, E. Howard Hunt, Tosh Plumlee, and James Files being some of the most notable.Don't be sheeple. Gather the information and think for yourself. The pieces to the puzzle are there.This message has been edited. Last edited by: mod_ivy, 03-25-09 09:04Was what I wrote that provocative? Not near as obscene as the abundant low IQ leaking through the keypads from the dimwits that frequent the Mythbuster forum. Anyway I enjoy most of you all and the information and points you bring. However with all the sniping as of late if someone were to stumble into this forum and take a snapshot one might think it a psychiatric forum where the patients run the agenda. Something to keep in mind if any of the Mythbuster rocket scientists drift this way. Keep after them Pasquale. You deserve the Medal of Honor for the Mythbuster stint. That senior membership over there doesn't come without some bloodshed. I sadly am only a junior member.

[Jsnow915]

Turtleman....you can't expect a forum without some feathers ruffled...I think me and Paul have it worked out...(John and Paul...how cool...right Bob)...anyway...it sounds like the way they attacked Pasquale they don't seem to be so forgiving at mythbusters forum.( i haven't gone there yet to check it out...otherwise I'd back 100% Pasquale)

[ChristophMessner]

Turtlemanexceptionally well written, your comprehension of the whole Kennedy-thing! You are not a junior member, but a grand master member! Don't be that modest! Now, if Mythbusters don't come along without cencorship, they are not that strong aren't they! So it's up to us to spread truth in comprehensions like your's and a redefinition of strength (strength = integrity; admitting mistakes is no disgrace; power by peacemaking through multilateralism) to the world by effective methods like posting your text not only on gatherings-of-supids, but to many other addresses. Your text is worth to be sent to a million of e-mail-addresses a day and to be read by students as obligatory first lecture hour!Chris Jsnow915 wrote:I think me and Paul have it worked out... Great!

[Bob]

Turtleman...good to see you come out of your shell. Seriously, excellent take. Feel free ANYTIME to join in here when you want to comment. The Mythbusters forum is run by the Discovery hacks that put out their bullshit regarding the JFK assassination ad nauseum. They are PART of the disinformation machine. It figures that their forums (and moderators) would follow suit.Also...great news about John and Paul. That is a GREAT combination as you know.

[Pasquale DiFabrizio]

turtleman wrote:I have been following Wim's forum for several years sifting through the posts and reading the contents page. I stayed away from posting as some of you all have such deep knowledge of the assassination that I really never felt worthy of engaging. I have been fascinated for most of my life with JFK's murder and the ensuing cover up. So I notice Pasquale is in a bit of a fix over there on the Mythbuster forum. Under some serious triangulation and just getting hit from all angles. The simpletons over there were so caught up in nuanced detail they really lost track of the big picture. So I registered and wrote a piece laying out the landscape leading up to 11/22/63. Well here is what I wrote;I have followed this thread for a few days and am stymied by the number of people that think Oswald acted alone. When you examine the body of evidence as a whole there is little doubt we had elements within our own government conspiring with organized crime to remove a president who was not popular with this group of power brokers. Set aside what you know about what the Warren Commission spoon fed the public and look at the array of power that needed for the liberal Kennedy to be replaced by a more conservative Johnson.> The Mafia: Bobby Kennedy as acting Attorney General was waging a war on organized crime across the country. He was also disrupting the anti Castro training camps the CIA was organizing for overthrowing the Cuban government. The mob also had major gambling interests in Cuba that were shut down when Castro rose to power. The oil industry and precious metals that were being exploited by American interests also ceased leaving many heavy hitters hung out to dry when Castro took over. These were very powerful people who were very well connected.> The CIA: Kennedy had disgraced the CIA by not providing air support during the Bay of Pigs resulting in a miserable defeat and major embarrassment. And he wanted to normalize relations with Cuba after the missile crisis was resolved. This resulted in Kennedy proclaiming he was going to break the Allen Dulles directed CIA into a thousand pieces. Dulles was fired. Only to resurface on the Warren Commission. The CIA was also deeply entrenched into the Vietnam conflict which was not yet a war. Kennedy had signed executive orders to pull out of Vietnam. This did not sit well with the "Cold War Machine", the CIA, Joint Chiefs, and the all powerful defense industry could not have this Massachusetts liberal pulling the plug on the Vietnam conflict that they stood to profit from for years to come. LBJ would give them the war they wanted. And boy did he. How about that Gulf of Tonkin? Kennedy had to be removed.> The anti Castro Cubans were favs of the CIA and despised Kennedy for his wavering support during the Bay of Pigs. These Cubans some of which are known terrorists and were used by the "Agency" for everything from Central American coups to the infamous Watergate break in. They resurface time after time since the '60's and seem to enjoy and incredible level of protection by our government and to this day many of these known criminals still walk the streets of Miami. Is there any wonder why the Cubans are the only Hispanic faction faithful to the Republican Party? The Cubans that made it here are devoutly anti Castro. They never forgave Kennedy or the Democratic party for the Bay of Pigs.If you really have the time and curiosity there are not that many pieces of the jig saw puzzle left to put into place. Too many powers at be stood to lose too much with Kennedy in office. All the players were in Dealy Plaza that fateful day. The rogue elements of the CIA (Sturgis, Hunt, Phillips). Weren't those guys involved in Watergate too? The Cubans were there as well as the Mob. There is a man named James Files sitting in prison at Stateville in Illinois who has confessed to being the shooter on the grassy knoll that actually fired the lethal round that killed Kennedy. This man is the genuine article. He worked for Roselli and Nicolletti (also in Dallas)under Chicago crime boss Sam Giancana. When the Roselli and Nicolleti were to testify before the House Select Committe on Assasinations both died mysterious deaths shortly before testifying. Add them to the numerous list of dead that knew too much. And if you really want to see what your government was up to in the Summer of '63 check out Ed Haslam's "Dr. Mary's Monkey." It is an account of Oswald's activity working for the CIA and the bizarre goings on in New Orleans involving a clandestine program to eliminate Castro and how Oswald had been prepared to take the fall for the killing of the president. Judyth Vary Baker is among the players who put the whole operation into perspective. Look it up. Read a sample chapter. It will bend your mind. The thing that amazes me most is how they pulled off the cover up. It really worked for a long time but people near death have spoken out. Chauncey Holt, E. Howard Hunt, Tosh Plumlee, and James Files being some of the most notable. The amount of people close to the investigation who died mysterious deaths is way beyond coincidence. Way beyond. Nixon knew all about it. Listen to him talk about that "Bay of Pigs" thing to Halderman on tape. It is on youtube. It was Nixon who lost to Kennedy by a razor thin margin in 1960. Of course Nixon would not have beaten Bobby Kennedy in 1968 but we all know what happened to Bobby. Or do we? One might surmise that the "Right Wing" does not play nice. Maybe you are the type of person that just believes your government couldn't possibly be part of such a hideous crime. A coup 'de tat. Well we sure have staged enough of them abroad if you do your homework. What we had was the perfect storm of CIA, Mob, anti Castro dissidents, Texas oil, and defense industry power moguls pulling off the crime of the century. And a disinformation campaign that is relentless to this day. I guess the easiest thing to do is believe whatever you are told by your government and the corporate lobby. This is the same government that denies the existence of UFO's and employs scare tactics and fear mongering to bully the masses. The same government that gave you the war with Iraq, legalized torture, suspended Habeas Corpus, and warrantless wiretapping. Don't be sheeple. Gather the information and think for yourself. The pieces to the puzzle are there. And if you still think your government just couldn't do anything so heinous...Well I have a bridge I would like to sell you.And here is what showed up after it was flagged because of "key words."Turtleman5Junior MemberRegistered: 03-25-09 Posted 03-25-09 06:23 AM Hide PostReply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post I have followed this thread for a few days and am stymied by the number of people that think Oswald acted alone. When you examine the body of evidence as a whole there is little doubt we had elements within our own government conspiring with organized crime to remove a president who was not popular across this array of power brokers. Set aside what you know about what the Warren Commission spoon fed the public and look at the array of power that needed for the liberal Kennedy to be replaced by a more conservative Johnson.> The Mafia:> The CIA:> The anti Castro CubansAll the players were in Dealy Plaza that fateful day. The rogue element of the CIA. The Cubans were there as well as the Mob. There is a man named James Files sitting in prison at Stateville in Illinois who has confessed to being the shooter on the grassy knoll that actually fired the lethal round that killed Kennedy. When Roselli and Nicolleti were to testify before the House Select Committe on Assasinations both died mysterious deaths shortly before testifying.The thing that amazes me most is how they pulled off the cover up. It really worked for a long time but people near death have spoken out. Chauncey Holt, E. Howard Hunt, Tosh Plumlee, and James Files being some of the most notable.Don't be sheeple. Gather the information and think for yourself. The pieces to the puzzle are there.This message has been edited. Last edited by: mod_ivy, 03-25-09 09:04Was what I wrote that provocative? Not near as obscene as the abundant low IQ leaking through the keypads from the dimwits that frequent the Mythbuster forum. Anyway I enjoy most of you all and the information and points you bring. However with all the sniping as of late if someone were to stumble into this forum and take a snapshot one might think it a psychiatric forum where the patients run the agenda. Something to keep in mind if any of the Mythbuster rocket scientists drift this way. Keep after them Pasquale. You deserve the Medal of Honor for the Mythbuster stint. That senior membership over there doesn't come without some bloodshed. I sadly am only a junior member.You're just fine, Turtleman5.I really appreciate you coming to help. Those people over there on that forum were having a little too much fun attacking me. Their latest stuff was a statement made by somebody saying that Files was "debunked" a long time ago. I pointed out to them that he has been criticisized but never debunked.I also said that, on the contrary, those criticisms of Files were debunked. Anyway, thanks for the help!!!!

[Pasquale DiFabrizio]

Regarding my "senior membership" at that Mythbusters forum, I only started posting last weekend when I said I would. That just goes to show how little it takes to become a senior member over there. I registered and started posting over there like late Friday or on Saturday. All you have to do is respond to a few members, and you'll suddenly be "promoted."

[Pasquale DiFabrizio]

Here's a warning about links over there. One of the members who has been arguing with me posted a link for me to see about a diagram of the path of the magic bullet.When I clicked on it, it was a page that was an Amazon page with a book for sale. A second later pop-ups began to appear on my computer screen...the kind of pop-ups that appear faster than you can close them.I dealt with it, and my computer is fine. I replied to them that the link was for a book for sale, then I left them a coded message that said "Nice try with that link."

[Pasquale DiFabrizio]

Ladies and gentelmen,Your help is appreciated. Someone replied to me on THAT forum saying that the spent cartridge casings found behind the fence couldn't possibly be from 1963 because of the stamped markings on the back of them.I know that is a false statement, but I can't find the information.Please help because I'd love to respond to that person. Pasquale

[Pennyworth]

Pasquale DiFabrizio wrote:Thanks Christoph and the rest of you. For the record, as soon as I tried to post a reply mentioning James Files, my post couldn't be displayed because there were certain "trigger" words. I first tried posting a link to this website for other readers to research the subject from other than the MacAdams site. That post was blocked for "review" because of "trigger words." Thinking that the "trigger words" was the website information, I simply tried to post another reply simply mentioning James Files, and that was blocked as well. I then posted a standard generic reply encouraging other readers of the forum to do their own research, and that post was displayed. Interesting, eh? It seems that "James Files" might be a "trigger word" on that forum that will prevent your posting from being displayed. I'm totally serious here.its probably the same group of debunking , puppy mill mentality people who have come up recently in the past few years(Bugliosi, Furman are two of the more prominent people) with the 1,000 page books saying that Oswald acted alone.I have noticed though that another one of these debunker doorstops haven't popped up like clockwork in the past months. Maybe we are finally sinking in beyond any doubt

[Pasquale DiFabrizio]

Pennyworth wrote:Pasquale DiFabrizio wrote:Thanks Christoph and the rest of you. For the record, as soon as I tried to post a reply mentioning James Files, my post couldn't be displayed because there were certain "trigger" words. I first tried posting a link to this website for other readers to research the subject from other than the MacAdams site. That post was blocked for "review" because of "trigger words." Thinking that the "trigger words" was the website information, I simply tried to post another reply simply mentioning James Files, and that was blocked as well. I then posted a standard generic reply encouraging other readers of the forum to do their own research, and that post was displayed. Interesting, eh? It seems that "James Files" might be a "trigger word" on that forum that will prevent your posting from being displayed. I'm totally serious here.its probably the same group of debunking , puppy mill mentality people who have come up recently in the past few years(Bugliosi, Furman are two of the more prominent people) with the 1,000 page books saying that Oswald acted alone.I have noticed though that another one of these debunker doorstops haven't popped up like clockwork in the past months. Maybe we are finally sinking in beyond any doubt I'm thinking so. Those people on that forum seem to be loosing steam. More importantly, other people are reading that forum and at least some of THEM are actually looking up the information for themselves. Persistence is key!