Yesterday I came in possession of a transcript of another completely unknown april 1992 interview with the late Chauncey Marvin Holt (died 1997)
Below is a fragment I would like to give you:
You think Montoya and Harrelson were shooters?
Holt - No, because they got to the boxcar too soon. And there was too many other good shooters around. You know that were in Dallas at that time. We're talking about Seraphin, Orlando Bosch, Freddy Lugo, Luis Posada, .....plus you had these other types wandering around, that I don't know what they were doing. For instance, William Robertson. I know he was there. He was a long time spook. One of the legends in the business. And Tony Po, Poshepny. They were like twins. He was there too.
Bosch was convicted for blowing up that airplane. He swore up and down that it was Lugo and Posada. That they were the actual bombers and set him up.
That's another thing we were running. We had this school, sort of a sideline, this club in Antelope Valley National Forest, and used to run rifle training. We had weapons we produced, very exotic types. Mostly we designed silencers, but we also made a lot of special silencers. Two stage silencers. One of the most interesting weapons we ever made was for a Cuban. He came in with an XP-100, a varmint rifle that shoots a 222, with a pistol grip, bolt operated for one shot. And this guy comes in and wanted us to replace the 222 barrel with a 14" version of the 243, which is really a rifle. So we had to start out getting the barrel made by somebody in Arizona. Then we replaced the one pistol grip with two pistol grips. It looked like a submachine gun and fitted it with a 8 power scope, a 3-9 variable scope, so he paid a lot of money for that gun.
But here you had a rifle that looked like a pistol and it was the ideal type gun if you were going to use it for an assassination like that. Since after all, we were within 20 yards of the shooting.
We made this gun in 1961 and the guy sold it back to me in the 70s. I never fired it, but there is a guy, a shooting instructor, a weapons expert, he did a lot of stuff for the CIA, all very legal, weapons evaluation of agency weapons. He had a Federal License. He took the gun out and shot it. And he's still alive.
Note from Wim: The XP-100 is the weapon that confessed grassy knoll shooter James E. Files says he fired to shoot Kennedy in the head.
BTW, "the shooting instructor, a weapons expert, he did a lot of stuff for the CIA, all very legal, weapons evaluation of agency weapons", is most likely Michael Harries. He died in 2000, supposedly a heart attack. He's the right one on this picture:
http://jfkmurdersolved.com/images/JandM ... arries.JPG
Attention: Chauncey Holt
Great stuff Wim. Excellent information on the XP Fireball. And this does again prove that the gun existed back then. This information probably means Harrelson wasn't a shooter, but he was heavily armed and Holt wasn't with him at the time of the shooting. And he is a known hitman in prison for killing a federal judge. How far was the box car they hid in from the grassy knoll area? What do we know about Freddy Lugo? And William Robertson? And Tony Postheny?
Found this information on William Robertson...
http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index ... wtopic=794
http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index ... wtopic=794
Found this on the education forum...
This was why LHO's M.A.C.S. -1 Detachment was pulled out of Iwakuni, Japan, and sent to Ping-Tung North
in Taiwan, and shortly thereafter was deployed to support the 1958 coup against Sukarno in Indonesia; the operation that was spearheaded by "Tony Po" [CIA Officer Anthony Poshepny]; who later became the model for the Marlon Brando character [Col. Kurz] in the film "Appocalypse Now".
I also found this...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthony_Poshepny
This was why LHO's M.A.C.S. -1 Detachment was pulled out of Iwakuni, Japan, and sent to Ping-Tung North
in Taiwan, and shortly thereafter was deployed to support the 1958 coup against Sukarno in Indonesia; the operation that was spearheaded by "Tony Po" [CIA Officer Anthony Poshepny]; who later became the model for the Marlon Brando character [Col. Kurz] in the film "Appocalypse Now".
I also found this...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthony_Poshepny
Here's a recent article (probably the one Wim refers to earlier) regarding Carriles, Bosch and Lugo...
http://www.politicalaffairs.net/article ... 204/1/161/
http://www.politicalaffairs.net/article ... 204/1/161/
No, this one:
I made one line red
Posted on Sun, Jul. 24, 2005
LUIS POSADA CARRILES CASE
Co-defendant: Extradite exile
Venezuela says Freddy Lugo conspired with Cuban exile militant Luis Posada Carriles to blow up a Cuban jetliner, but Lugo denies it and said Posada should return to jail.
BY OSCAR CORRAL
achardy@herald.com
CARACAS - AND ALFONSO CHARDY
Breaking 29 years of silence, one of two men convicted in the 1976 bombing of a Cuban jetliner that killed 73 people said in an exclusive interview that exile militant Luis Posada Carriles should be extradited to Venezuela to stand trial in the case.
But Freddy Lugo -- who claims he was an innocent dupe in the bomb plot -- denied that he made incriminating statements Venezuelan officials attribute to him in their application to have Posada sent to Caracas.
Posada, a former CIA operative who has been linked to a series of 1997 bombings at Cuban hotels, is in U.S. custody after sneaking into the country this year. He is seeking asylum in a case that largely hinges on the shadowy events of 1976 -- the year Lugo says changed his life forever.
Lugo told The Herald that Posada should be returned to Venezuela because he had escaped from a Venezuelan jail before a case against him in the airliner bombing was resolved.
Posada escaped in 1985 -- after an initial acquittal but while a prosecutor's appeal was pending. Two years later, a Caracas court acquitted Posada's associate, Cuban exile militant Orlando Bosch. But the court convicted Lugo and his friend, Hernan Ricardo.
''He escaped from a Venezuelan jail,'' Lugo said during the hourlong interview. ``He must come to finish serving his time here, like I did, being innocent.''
In a June 10 statement as part of its extradition request, the Venezuelan Embassy in Washington, D.C., cited Lugo as a key witness against Posada. The statement said the Venezuelan government had delivered to the United States evidence that includes ``the testimony of Freddy Lugo confirming his participation in the blowing up of the plane and of urgent calls made by [Lugo and Ricardo] to Posada Carriles shortly after the disaster, seeking his help.''
That testimony has not been released to the public. But Lugo said of it: ``It's false.''
Bernardo Alvarez, the Venezuelan ambassador to the United States, said what matters legally in the case is Lugo's prior testimony.
''There are statements on the part of Freddy Lugo which are clear and consistent over the years,'' Alvarez said in an e-mail to The Herald Friday. ``We do not know what Lugo said or why he said it to The Miami Herald, but we know what he told the authorities and this is consistent with the submitted evidence.''
Posada told The Herald earlier this year that he didn't believe Lugo was involved in the bombing. ''In my opinion, Hernan Ricardo may have been involved, although he always denied everything,'' he said. ``Freddy Lugo was a fool.''
Lugo still lives in Caracas, in a one-story whitewashed house in a working class neighborhood. It's surrounded by a 10-foot concrete wall. He says he makes his money driving a cab.
He lives with his sister, his son and his daughter-in-law and keeps a low profile.
During the interview at his home, Lugo immediately proclaimed his innocence. He also said he did not know if Posada or the other men implicated in the attacks -- Ricardo and Bosch -- were guilty or innocent.
''I only know that I know nothing,'' Lugo said. ``I participated indirectly without knowing anything.''
A SCAPEGOAT
Alternately serious and jovial, Lugo portrayed himself as a scapegoat, an innocent bystander drawn into a plot that the other three may or may not have hatched without his knowledge.
''Journalists perhaps don't want to interview me because I don't have anything explosive to tell them,'' Lugo said.
Lugo and Ricardo were news photographers for the Caracas newspaper El Mundo at the time of the 1976 bombing. They were also part-time covert agents for DISIP, the Venezuelan state security agency.
One of the agency's top officials -- before he retired and started his own private security agency -- was Posada. Posada also owned a private security firm in Caracas that employed Ricardo -- though just before the bombing, Posada reassigned him to serve as Bosch's chauffeur.
Lugo said that when he took a trip overseas with Ricardo in October 1976, he had no idea the plane was doomed. He said he went along because he wanted to buy camera equipment -- and Ricardo had offered to pay for the plane tickets.
''What an expensive trip, right? It destroyed my life,'' he said.
Lugo and Ricardo left Caracas for Trinidad and Tobago, where they boarded the Cubana de Aviacion DC-8. They got off during a stopover in Barbados. Shortly after takeoff from Barbados, the plane exploded.
Lugo and Ricardo left Barbados in a hurry, Venezuelan court records say. Shortly after they reached Trinidad, they were arrested.
Along with Bosch and Posada, Lugo and Ricardo were tried in Venezuela and acquitted by a military court in 1980, but the case was then continued in a civilian court.
By 1987, Posada had escaped. Bosch was acquitted that year. Lugo and Ricardo were convicted and sentenced to 20 years -- though in 1993 they were placed on supervised release.
Lugo said he had not had any contact with Ricardo since. Ricardo could not be reached for comment.
Posada's attorney in Caracas, Joaquin Chaffardet, and Posada both told The Herald they believe Ricardo is now out of Venezuela and working as an informant for the U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration. DEA spokesman Garrison Courtney said the agency does not confirm whether someone is an informant.
According to official Venezuelan documents, Lugo told authorities that immediately after he and Ricardo learned the plane had exploded, Ricardo was both distraught and incredulous.
'JACKAL' REFERENCE
The Venezuelan account says Ricardo called himself the world's deadliest terrorist -- deadlier even than Venezuela's notorious Carlos ``The Jackal.''
Venezuelan investigators said Lugo quoted Ricardo as saying: 'Damn, Lugo, I am desperate and I feel like crying because I had never killed anyone. . . . `The Jackal' may have his record as a great terrorist, but I surpassed him. What's more, I surpassed even the Palestinians in terrorism and now I am the one who has the record, because I am the one who blew up that thing.''
Lugo told The Herald he never heard Ricardo make any such statement. ''All those things are false,'' he said, adding statements attributed to him during the investigation were fabrications by detectives ``to advance their careers.''
Lugo revealed a hint of bitterness toward Posada, Ricardo and Bosch, insinuating that he had been deliberately sucked into a sinister plot against Fidel Castro.
He said that during his time in Venezuelan prisons, he distanced himself from Posada, Ricardo and Bosch because he felt that associating with the three men would have made him appear guilty.
''I didn't want to have any relations with those people because that would compromise me more,'' he said. ''I didn't have anything to do with pro-Castro groups or anti-Castro groups or any of those things.'' He said the strong moral support and legal assistance that Posada, Bosch and Ricardo received from Cuban exiles while in prison did not extend to him.
Now, Lugo said, he just wants to live the rest of his life quietly.
''I wander around the streets of Caracas relaxed,'' he said. ``I don't have any problems or fear. I feel innocent down to the last bone in my body.''
I made one line red
Posted on Sun, Jul. 24, 2005
LUIS POSADA CARRILES CASE
Co-defendant: Extradite exile
Venezuela says Freddy Lugo conspired with Cuban exile militant Luis Posada Carriles to blow up a Cuban jetliner, but Lugo denies it and said Posada should return to jail.
BY OSCAR CORRAL
achardy@herald.com
CARACAS - AND ALFONSO CHARDY
Breaking 29 years of silence, one of two men convicted in the 1976 bombing of a Cuban jetliner that killed 73 people said in an exclusive interview that exile militant Luis Posada Carriles should be extradited to Venezuela to stand trial in the case.
But Freddy Lugo -- who claims he was an innocent dupe in the bomb plot -- denied that he made incriminating statements Venezuelan officials attribute to him in their application to have Posada sent to Caracas.
Posada, a former CIA operative who has been linked to a series of 1997 bombings at Cuban hotels, is in U.S. custody after sneaking into the country this year. He is seeking asylum in a case that largely hinges on the shadowy events of 1976 -- the year Lugo says changed his life forever.
Lugo told The Herald that Posada should be returned to Venezuela because he had escaped from a Venezuelan jail before a case against him in the airliner bombing was resolved.
Posada escaped in 1985 -- after an initial acquittal but while a prosecutor's appeal was pending. Two years later, a Caracas court acquitted Posada's associate, Cuban exile militant Orlando Bosch. But the court convicted Lugo and his friend, Hernan Ricardo.
''He escaped from a Venezuelan jail,'' Lugo said during the hourlong interview. ``He must come to finish serving his time here, like I did, being innocent.''
In a June 10 statement as part of its extradition request, the Venezuelan Embassy in Washington, D.C., cited Lugo as a key witness against Posada. The statement said the Venezuelan government had delivered to the United States evidence that includes ``the testimony of Freddy Lugo confirming his participation in the blowing up of the plane and of urgent calls made by [Lugo and Ricardo] to Posada Carriles shortly after the disaster, seeking his help.''
That testimony has not been released to the public. But Lugo said of it: ``It's false.''
Bernardo Alvarez, the Venezuelan ambassador to the United States, said what matters legally in the case is Lugo's prior testimony.
''There are statements on the part of Freddy Lugo which are clear and consistent over the years,'' Alvarez said in an e-mail to The Herald Friday. ``We do not know what Lugo said or why he said it to The Miami Herald, but we know what he told the authorities and this is consistent with the submitted evidence.''
Posada told The Herald earlier this year that he didn't believe Lugo was involved in the bombing. ''In my opinion, Hernan Ricardo may have been involved, although he always denied everything,'' he said. ``Freddy Lugo was a fool.''
Lugo still lives in Caracas, in a one-story whitewashed house in a working class neighborhood. It's surrounded by a 10-foot concrete wall. He says he makes his money driving a cab.
He lives with his sister, his son and his daughter-in-law and keeps a low profile.
During the interview at his home, Lugo immediately proclaimed his innocence. He also said he did not know if Posada or the other men implicated in the attacks -- Ricardo and Bosch -- were guilty or innocent.
''I only know that I know nothing,'' Lugo said. ``I participated indirectly without knowing anything.''
A SCAPEGOAT
Alternately serious and jovial, Lugo portrayed himself as a scapegoat, an innocent bystander drawn into a plot that the other three may or may not have hatched without his knowledge.
''Journalists perhaps don't want to interview me because I don't have anything explosive to tell them,'' Lugo said.
Lugo and Ricardo were news photographers for the Caracas newspaper El Mundo at the time of the 1976 bombing. They were also part-time covert agents for DISIP, the Venezuelan state security agency.
One of the agency's top officials -- before he retired and started his own private security agency -- was Posada. Posada also owned a private security firm in Caracas that employed Ricardo -- though just before the bombing, Posada reassigned him to serve as Bosch's chauffeur.
Lugo said that when he took a trip overseas with Ricardo in October 1976, he had no idea the plane was doomed. He said he went along because he wanted to buy camera equipment -- and Ricardo had offered to pay for the plane tickets.
''What an expensive trip, right? It destroyed my life,'' he said.
Lugo and Ricardo left Caracas for Trinidad and Tobago, where they boarded the Cubana de Aviacion DC-8. They got off during a stopover in Barbados. Shortly after takeoff from Barbados, the plane exploded.
Lugo and Ricardo left Barbados in a hurry, Venezuelan court records say. Shortly after they reached Trinidad, they were arrested.
Along with Bosch and Posada, Lugo and Ricardo were tried in Venezuela and acquitted by a military court in 1980, but the case was then continued in a civilian court.
By 1987, Posada had escaped. Bosch was acquitted that year. Lugo and Ricardo were convicted and sentenced to 20 years -- though in 1993 they were placed on supervised release.
Lugo said he had not had any contact with Ricardo since. Ricardo could not be reached for comment.
Posada's attorney in Caracas, Joaquin Chaffardet, and Posada both told The Herald they believe Ricardo is now out of Venezuela and working as an informant for the U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration. DEA spokesman Garrison Courtney said the agency does not confirm whether someone is an informant.
According to official Venezuelan documents, Lugo told authorities that immediately after he and Ricardo learned the plane had exploded, Ricardo was both distraught and incredulous.
'JACKAL' REFERENCE
The Venezuelan account says Ricardo called himself the world's deadliest terrorist -- deadlier even than Venezuela's notorious Carlos ``The Jackal.''
Venezuelan investigators said Lugo quoted Ricardo as saying: 'Damn, Lugo, I am desperate and I feel like crying because I had never killed anyone. . . . `The Jackal' may have his record as a great terrorist, but I surpassed him. What's more, I surpassed even the Palestinians in terrorism and now I am the one who has the record, because I am the one who blew up that thing.''
Lugo told The Herald he never heard Ricardo make any such statement. ''All those things are false,'' he said, adding statements attributed to him during the investigation were fabrications by detectives ``to advance their careers.''
Lugo revealed a hint of bitterness toward Posada, Ricardo and Bosch, insinuating that he had been deliberately sucked into a sinister plot against Fidel Castro.
He said that during his time in Venezuelan prisons, he distanced himself from Posada, Ricardo and Bosch because he felt that associating with the three men would have made him appear guilty.
''I didn't want to have any relations with those people because that would compromise me more,'' he said. ''I didn't have anything to do with pro-Castro groups or anti-Castro groups or any of those things.'' He said the strong moral support and legal assistance that Posada, Bosch and Ricardo received from Cuban exiles while in prison did not extend to him.
Now, Lugo said, he just wants to live the rest of his life quietly.
''I wander around the streets of Caracas relaxed,'' he said. ``I don't have any problems or fear. I feel innocent down to the last bone in my body.''
-
john geraghty
- Posts: 119
- Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2019 8:23 pm