I pissed some people off...guess who?

[Bob]

Phil and Kirk...well spoken thoughts again. I sort of feel honored that the lone nut club has singled me out. Character assassination is their best (and weakest) weapon. They have done that to Mark Lane, Jim Garrison, Oliver Stone, Jim Marrs, Robert Groden, Wim Dankbaar, James Douglass, Doug Horne and many others. When it comes to actually using facts as a weapon, they instead use ridiculous conjecture, as they try to make a believable hypothesis about what really happened in Dealey Plaza on 11/22/1963. Arlen Specter was given a full career in politics after he fabricated the biggest political lie of all time...the single...er...magic bullet theory. When it's all said and done, it will be placed right next to the other blatant lies in American history, like the sinking of the Maine by the Spanish, the Gulf of Tonkin incident and others of the same ilk. What do those lies have in common. They all allowed unneccesary wars to happen. Wars that would help the cause of the power elite. The Spanish-American War happened right as the Industrial Revolution was taking place. The Rockefellers, the Rothschilds, the Fords and people of their ilk were really taking power in the United States then. Soon after that came WWI, the Federal Reserve, the federal income tax etc. Then came the FBI and the OSS, followed by WWII. That spawned the CIA and their influence in wars and government takeovers. It led to the Bay of Pigs, the JFK assassination, Vietnam, Iran/Conta, Mena, arming guys named Osama and Saddam in the 80's etc. This is a yarn that keeps spinning and keeps getting bigger. The CIA has never been stronger than they are today. They are married to big banking and the MSM. Again, look up Operation Mockingbird. I guess the folks in the other forum forgot about that one. You know, where the CIA infiltrates the MSM to put out their message and to hide their sins. Look at the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq. The CIA endorsed both wars. As did the Military Industrial Complex. As did big oil. As did big banking. Look at the profits of Halliburton, General Dynamics, Raytheon, Blackwater etc. What has the goverment done? They have protected the CIA from any repercussions regarding torture tactics, that they have obviously used. They have given HUNDREDS of BILLIONS to big banking and even with their new "legislation" to reform Wall Street, the Fed is still the fox running the hen house there. Look at big oil. Look at the massive profits. In Afghanistan, we are supposedly fighting the terrorists. Hardly any mention is given to the oil pipeline that runs through that country to help big oil. What about the huge amount of oil in Iraq? Big oil is like Pavlov's dog looking at that gift. The gift we got from big oil was the BP oil spill in the Gulf, that is the worst ecological event in U.S. history. BP was not alone in their guilt. They got plenty of help from our friends at Halliburton and Transocean. So what is next? Look for something to happen soon in Iran. The CIA, the Military Industrial Complex, big oil and big banking desperately want the U.S. to intervene there. Iraq has a LOT of oil, but Iran has even MORE. Israel now has 3 nuclear subs stationed off Iran. Israel is as out of control now, as the U.S. was when Dumbya and Five Deferment Dick were running the country. Bottom line, I know I went on a bit of a rant, but just watch when some people come on FOX, CNN or MSNBC. They have an agenda, whether it's a book, or passing the message that the power elite want delivered. The MSM is the place where the secrets are kept under wrap. Why? Because they are as guilty as the people that concocted the lie in the first place, as they helped in the cover up. Just in case the other forum is monitoring this thread...see this...http://whatreallyhappened.com/RANCHO/PO ... .htmlBeing naive is one thing, being a disinformation distributor is another.

[kenmurray]

Bob, it pains me to tell you that the great Von Pein thinks that your article on Perry was silly. Bob, I know that you are shocked over this. But don't worry. We all know by now that anything that Von Pein says believe the OPPOSITE.

[Bob]

kenmurray wrote:Bob, it pains me to tell you that the great Von Pein thinks that your article on Perry was silly. Bob, I know that you are shocked over this. But don't worry. We all know by now that anything that Von Pein says believe the OPPOSITE. DVP must have seen me walk...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IqhlQfXUk7wWhich takes me a Confuciius line that DVP and his gang should consider while they distribute their propaganda. The line goes something like this..."He who asks a question may feel silly for a moment, but he who NEVER asks a question will be silly forever."

[kenmurray]

Bob wrote:kenmurray wrote:Bob, it pains me to tell you that the great Von Pein thinks that your article on Perry was silly. Bob, I know that you are shocked over this. But don't worry. We all know by now that anything that Von Pein says believe the OPPOSITE. DVP must have seen me walk...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IqhlQfXUk7wWhich takes me a Confuciius line that DVP and his gang should consider while they distribute their propaganda. The line goes something like this..."He who asks a question may feel silly for a moment, but he who NEVER asks a question will be silly forever." Monty Python... You gotta love it.

[Bob]

DVP: "Silly Bob, disinformation tricks are for the kids in the lone nut club. Why use facts, when bullshit works just as well." http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qNUJsJMWB5I

[Kirk]

Bob wrote:kenmurray wrote:Bob, it pains me to tell you that the great Von Pein thinks that your article on Perry was silly. Bob, I know that you are shocked over this. But don't worry. We all know by now that anything that Von Pein says believe the OPPOSITE. DVP must have seen me walk...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IqhlQfXUk7wWhich takes me a Confuciius line that DVP and his gang should consider while they distribute their propaganda. The line goes something like this..."He who asks a question may feel silly for a moment, but he who NEVER asks a question will be silly forever."I use to do the Silly walk or my version to see, if my former wife could take the embarrassment. Well she is a former wife so.....that answers it.

[Phil Dragoo]

KirkRe Posner/Case Closed, see also, Weisberg/Case Open. The thin 1994 book slices and dices the fat 1993 slab of head cheese.Bob, you are defined by your enemies. When your enemies are in league with history's darkest liars and murderers, you may deduce your path the morally correct one.Now in Horne III we see Humes and Boswell processed the brain of the murdered president on Monday the 25th and sent all of Stringer's photos down the memory hole.Horne, Boswell and Fincke processed a comparatively whole brain round the end of the month, and it's those photos we see today.I particularly like the one where Ebersole took a hole punch to a pie pan and placed it in an x-ray film sandwich.A hole punch produces a disc (often with a missing crescent from adjacent punching) of nominal 1/4" diameter, very near the 6.5 mm seen on the AP skull.Posner trumpeted the finding of "death by natural causes" of Carlos Ghigliotti the FLIR analyst for the Davidian survivors on trial who was on the verge of demonstrating 200 shots into the building on April 19, 1995, the day they went Tiananmen on 80 men, women, and children.All of the world's totalitarians are on the same page, and we're the footnotes revealing their lies.

[Bob]

Nice take Phil. Back to the fact that the CIA has people in the MSM and in other facets on their payroll. Obviously the source of income doesn't come DIRECTLY from the CIA, as they use other companies or sources as their go between. One of the better articles I've read about Operation Mockingbird, came from Carl Bernstein, who wrote All he President's Men, along with his co-author Bob Woodward. Bernstein wrote this article for the Rolling Stone and it really sheds some light on the subject. Although he didn't write about it, Bernstein surely knew that his partner Woodward was the type of person he wrote about in this article. Anyway, here it is... In 1953, Joseph Alsop, then one of America’s leading syndicated columnists, went to the Philippines to cover an election. He did not go because he was asked to do so by his syndicate. He did not go because he was asked to do so by the newspapers that printed his column. He went at the request of the CIA.Alsop is one of more than 400 American journalists who in the past twenty-five years have secretly carried out assignments for the Central Intelligence Agency, according to documents on file at CIA headquarters.Some of these journalists’ relationships with the Agency were tacit; some were explicit. There was cooperation, accommodation and overlap. Journalists provided a full range of clandestine services -- from simple intelligence gathering to serving as go-betweens with spies in Communist countries. Reporters shared their notebooks with the CIA. Editors shared their staffs. Some of the journalists were Pulitzer Prize winners, distinguished reporters who considered themselves ambassadors-without-portfolio for their country. Most were less exalted: foreign correspondents who found that their association with the Agency helped their work; stringers and freelancers who were as interested it the derring-do of the spy business as in filing articles, and, the smallest category, full-time CIA employees masquerading as journalists abroad. In many instances, CIA documents show, journalists were engaged to perform tasks for the CIA with the consent of the managements America’s leading news organizations.The history of the CIA’s involvement with the American press continues to be shrouded by an official policy of obfuscation and deception...Among the executives who lent their cooperation to the Agency were William Paley of the Columbia Broadcasting System, Henry Luce of Time Inc., Arthur Hays Sulzberger of the New York Times, Barry Bingham Sr. of the Louisville Courier-Journal and James Copley of the Copley News Service. Other organizations which cooperated with the CIA include the American Broadcasting Company, the National Broadcasting Company, the Associated Press, United Press International, Reuters, Hearst Newspapers, Scripps-Howard, Newsweek magazine, the Mutual Broadcasting System, The Miami Herald, and the old Saturday Evening Post and New York Herald-Tribune. By far the most valuable of these associations, according to CIA officials, have been with The New York Times, CBS, and Time Inc.From the Agency’s perspective, there is nothing untoward in such relationships, and any ethical questions are a matter for the journalistic profession to resolve, not the intelligence community...Many journalists were used by the CIA to assist in this process and they had the reputation of being among the best in the business. The peculiar nature of the job of the foreign correspondent is ideal for such work; he is accorded unusual access, by his host country, permitted to travel in areas often off-limits to other Americans, spends much of his time cultivating sources in governments, academic institutions, the military establishment and the scientific communities. He has the opportunity to form long-term personal relationships with sources and -- perhaps more than any other category of American operative - is in a position to make correct judgments about the susceptibility and availability of foreign nationals for recruitment as spies.The Agency’s dealings with the press began during the earliest stages of the Cold War. Allen Dulles, who became director of the CIA in 1953, sought to establish a recruiting-and-cover capability within America’s most prestigious journalistic institutions. By operating under the guise of accredited news correspondents, Dulles believed, CIA operatives abroad would be accorded a degree of access and freedom of movement unobtainable under almost any other type of cover.American publishers, like so many other corporate and institutional leaders at the time, were willing us commit the resources of their companies to the struggle against “global Communism.” Accordingly, the traditional line separating the American press corps and government was often indistinguishable: rarely was a news agency used to provide cover for CIA operatives abroad without the knowledge and consent of either its principal owner; publisher or senior editor. Thus, contrary to the notion that the CIA era and news executives allowed themselves and their organizations to become handmaidens to the intelligence services. “Let’s not pick on some poor reporters, for God’s sake,” William Colby exclaimed at one point to the Church committee’s investigators. “Let’s go to the managements. They were witting” In all, about twenty-five news organizations (including those listed at the beginning of this article) provided cover for the Agency...Many journalists who covered World War II were close to people in the Office of Strategic Services, the wartime predecessor of the CIA; more important, they were all on the same side. When the war ended and many OSS officials went into the CIA, it was only natural that these relationships would continue.Meanwhile, the first postwar generation of journalists entered the profession; they shared the same political and professional values as their mentors. “You had a gang of people who worked together during World War II and never got over it,” said one Agency official. “They were genuinely motivated and highly susceptible to intrigue and being on the inside. Then in the Fifties and Sixties there was a national consensus about a national threat. The Vietnam War tore everything to pieces - shredded the consensus and threw it in the air.” Another Agency official observed: “Many journalists didn’t give a second thought to associating with the Agency. But there was a point when the ethical issues which most people had submerged finally surfaced. Today, a lot of these guys vehemently deny that they had any relationship with the Agency.”The CIA even ran a formal training program in the 1950s to teach its agents to be journalists. Intelligence officers were “taught to make noises like reporters,” explained a high CIA official, and were then placed in major news organizations with help from management. “These were the guys who went through the ranks and were told, “You’re going to be a journalist,” the CIA official said. Relatively few of the 400-some relationships described in Agency files followed that pattern, however; most involved persons who were already bona fide journalists when they began undertaking tasks for the Agency. The Agency’s relationships with journalists, as described in CIA files, include the following general categories:* Legitimate, accredited staff members of news organizations - usually reporters. Some were paid; some worked for the Agency on a purely voluntary basis.* Stringers and freelancers. Most were payrolled by the Agency under standard contractual terms.* Employees of so-called CIA “proprietaries.” During the past twenty-five years, the Agency has secretly bankrolled numerous foreign press services, periodicals and newspapers -- both English and foreign language -- which provided excellent cover for CIA operatives.* Columnists and commentators. There are perhaps a dozen well-known columnists and broadcast commentators whose relationships with the CIA go far beyond those normally maintained between reporters and their sources. They are referred to at the Agency as “known assets” and can be counted on to perform a variety of undercover tasks; they are considered receptive to the Agency’s point of view on various subjects.Murky details of CIA relationships with individuals and news organizations began trickling out in 1973 when it was first disclosed that the CIA had, on occasion, employed journalists. Those reports, combined with new information, serve as casebook studies of the Agency’s use of journalists for intelligence purposes.The New York Times - The Agency’s relationship with the Times was by far its most valuable among newspapers, according to CIA officials. [It was] general Times policy to provide assistance to the CIA whenever possible...CIA officials cite two reasons why the Agency’s working relationship with the Times was closer and more extensive than with any other paper: the fact that the Times maintained the largest foreign news operation in American daily journalism; and the close personal ties between the men who ran both institutions...The Columbia Broadcasting System -- CBS was unquestionably the CIA’s most valuable broadcasting asset. CBS president William Paley and Allen Dulles enjoyed an easy working and social relationship. Over the years, the network provided cover for CIA employees, including at least one well-known foreign correspondent and several stringers; it supplied outtakes of newsfilm to the CIA; established a formal channel of communication between the Washington bureau chief and the Agency; gave the Agency access to the CBS newsfilm library; and allowed reports by CBS correspondents to the Washington and New York newsrooms to be routinely monitored by the CIA. Once a year during the 1950s and early 1960s, CBS correspondents joined the CIA hierarchy for private dinners and briefings...At the headquarters of CBS News in New York, Paley’s cooperation with the CIA is taken for granted by many news executives and reporters, despite the denials. Paley, 76, was not interviewed by Salant’s investigators. “It wouldn’t do any good,” said one CBS executive. “It is the single subject about which his memory has failed.”Time and Newsweek magazines - According to CIA and Senate sources, Agency files contain written agreements with former foreign correspondents and stringers for both the weekly news magazines. The same sources refused to say whether the CIA has ended all its associations with individuals who work for the two publications. Allen Dulles often interceded with his good friend, the late Henry Luce, founder of Time and Life magazines, who readily allowed certain members of his staff to work for the Agency and agreed to provide jobs and credentials for other CIA operatives who lacked journalistic experience...At Newsweek, Agency sources reported, the CIA engaged the services of several foreign correspondents and stringers under arrangements approved by senior editors at the magazine...“To the best of my knowledge:’ said [Harry] Kern, [Newsweek’s foreign editor from 1945 to 1956] “nobody at Newsweek worked for the CIA.... The informal relationship was there. Why have anybody sign anything? What we knew we told them [the CIA] and the State Department.... When I went to Washington, I would talk to Foster or Allen Dulles about what was going on .... We thought it was admirable at the time. We were all on the same side.” CIA officials say that Kern's dealings with the Agency were extensive...When Newsweek was purchased by the Washington Post Company, publisher Philip L. Graham was informed by Agency officials that the CIA occasionally used the magazine for cover purposes, according to CIA sources. “It was widely known that Phil Graham was somebody you could get help from,” said a former deputy director of the Agency... But Graham, who committed suicide in 1963, apparently knew little of the specifics of any cover arrangements with Newsweek, CIA sources said...Information about Agency dealings with the Washington Post newspaper is extremely sketchy. According to CIA officials, some Post stringers have been CIA employees, but these officials say they do not know if anyone in the Post management was aware of the arrangements...Other major news organizations - According to Agency officials, CIA files document additional cover arrangements with the following news gathering organizations, among others: the New York Herald Tribune, Saturday Evening Post, Scripps-Howard Newspapers, Hearst Newspapers, Associated Press, United Press International, the Mutual Broadcasting System, Reuters and The Miami Herald...“And that's just a small part of the list,” in the words of one official who served in the CIA hierarchy. Like many sources, this official said that the only way to end the uncertainties about aid furnished the Agency by journalists is to disclose the contents of the CIA files - a course opposed by almost all of the thirty-five present and former CIA officials interviewed over the course of a year.The CIA’s use of journalists continued virtually unabated until 1973 when, in response to public disclosure that the Agency had secretly employed American reporters, William Colby began scaling down the program. In his public statements, Colby conveyed the impression that the use of journalists had been minimal and of limited importance to the Agency.He then initiated a series of moves intended to convince the press, Congress and the public that the CIA had gotten out of the news business. But according to Agency officials, Colby had in fact thrown a protective net around his most valuable intelligence assets in the journalistic community...At the headquarters of CBS News in New York, Paley’s cooperation with the CIA is taken for granted by many news executives and reporters, despite the denials. Paley, 76, was not interviewed by Salant’s investigators. “It wouldn’t do any good,” said one CBS executive. “It is the single subject about which his memory has failed.”After Colby left the Agency on January 28th, 1976, and was succeeded by George Bush, the CIA announced a new policy: “Effective immediately, the CIA will not enter into any paid or contract relationship with any full-time or part-time news correspondent accredited by any US news service, newspaper, periodical, radio or television network or station.” ... The text of the announcement noted that the CIA would continue to “welcome” the voluntary, unpaid cooperation of journalists. Thus, many relationships were permitted to remain intact.

[piopat]

hi guys i havent posted here for a while now but i have popped in from time to time and read some great threads , i hope yyou dont mind me posting here . i was on another forum recently having a look around (not a jfk forum ,but it has a conspiracy section) i had a read as i like to see what people think on this subject . it was mostly how oswald was the lone killer stuff (of course we are all entitled to our own opinion ) and how he was seen doing the shooting of both jfk and tippit. i decided to ask them if they actually read any of the witness statements ,and i mentioned a few witnesses and what they said .the answers that came back was based im sure on the disinformation that is put out there by people like mack/posner/myers/bugliosi etc ,the answers were (why would the warren commission lie ,after all it was setup by the government) and the old chestnut (witnesses saw oswald do it ,thats good enough for me ) and the best was (i watched the documentary jfk inside the target car recently ,now im 100% convinced oswald was the killer) also this comment (i watched this program on national geographic and they had ballistics experts who examined the blood splatter they said it was impossible that the shot came from anywhere apart from the bood depository. furthermore they hired a world class firearms expert who went back to the sight in dallas and looked at all the possible places where you could have got a shot at the car. the grassy knowl was deemed to be impossible by him to get the shot in time and that was with modern weapons. i think the movie jfk has done a lot to get people thinking about a conspiracy but its basically rubbish) . he based all his comments on watching jfk inside the target car ,i was frustrated and sad having given many many facts and links only for them to be repeatly ignored (as his mind was made up ) . it seems posner/mack and co are doing a good job . its great to see how knowledgeable you guys are and i greatly enjoy reading your posts ,keep up your good work guys and ttalk soon i hope.here is a link i found also with an article (with malice ) its probably been posted here before (sorry if thats the case)http://www.jfk-online.com/myers.html

[kenmurray]

Piopat, that documentary "JFK: Inside The Target Car " was an absolute awful show led by that modern day Judas Gary Mack.Here is Jim DiEugenio's review of that documentary in case you haven't seen it. It speaks volumes about the motives of Gary Mack:http://www.ctka.net/2009/target_car_jd. ... r_jd3.html