Who Decided?

[ThomZajac]

Thanks, Bruce, you have made my day. I'd heard so much about you and it is truly terrific to see that you're posting once again. Has Jimmy ever thought about writing an autobiography? Even without the JFK assassination it seems he's lived an amazing life and that he could provide some incredible insights into covert operations.As far as "Who decided' I don't think there can be any doubt that JFK had a lot of people in power who would have been all too happy to have a few bullets put into his head; Dulles and company, Johnson, Hoover, top military, the Federal Reserve guys and other big bankers both domestic and international, oil men, the mafia. Still, someone or a few had to have made the decision, and my working theory is that it was Dulles and the invisible guys, perhaps Rockeller and Rothschild, Initiating the plan would have been like setting a fire in extremely dry brush on the hottest day of the year- there wasn't going to be a whole lot (any?) resistance, but someone had to decide to torch the place. What two or three names do you think would have been the most likely?

[Bob]

Bruce Patrick Brychek wrote:Dear Wim, Bob, Tom Jeffers, Thom Zajac, and Fellow JFK Forum Members:Thom Zajac - I have been out of town, and just read your Headline, Who Decided. I really like it, as I see it as one of my favorite intellectual exercises. I often focus on some of the "negatives of the Kennedy Family, Joe, Sr, JFK, and RFK," as I see a direct traceable causible link as to the who, what when, where, why, and how of the JFK and RFK assassinations ala coup de' tats. If you study these in a Sequential Time Line Analysis, great things take take shape. I know that this drives some of the JFK/RFK lovers crazy, and I do not intend it. But you must analyze the negatives to see what falls out of the trees.For example, at the time of JFK'S election, Jimmy Hoffa and the unions, Tony Accardo, Sam Giancana and the mob, the Chicago unions and mafia, the West Virginia unions, coal miners unions, and mafia, the CIA and portions of the Military Industrial Complex, the Jesuits and the Roman Catholic Church, and many, many others were strongly behind JFK because Joe Kennedy convinced them/made them think, rightly or wrongly that "they all owned JFK." These, when JFK was elected, they were all in his corner, rightly or wrongly. But on 11.22.1963 each group that I mentioned were all against JFK, rightly or wrongly.This change in allegiances can be graphed out, and give answers or indications of individuals and groups that all changed positions, for reasons of major consequences to their strongest of interests, which would put them on simultaneous collision courses with JFK.Following this thinking will help.Thom Zajax, I really enjoy many of your Headlines, and posts, whether I agree or disagree. You are certainly as my friend Bob says "...a great new member." Respectfully,Bruce Patrick Brychek.I'll second that motion by Bruce. Thom is one of many that have joined the forum in the last year or so that make this forum educational, thought provoking and vigorous (yet friendly) debating excercize at times. Recently, we have also had several new members take this forum to a new plateau with their expertise on various subjects. Bruce coming back has made this forum complete though. Again...call me Mr. Redundant...but the collective minds in this forum right now is as good as it gets.

[Dealey Joe]

Yes Bob I think you are correct in your evaluation, everyone comes from a little different perspective of things and that brings a freshness to the forum. It causes everyone to think things out.One of the great laws of nature is that it takes a difference of polarity to cause movement.+/-, North Pole/South Pole ect.I feel a little out of place because I am not an able researcher however I am 68 years old and have first hand experienced the Pre Kenedy years. It will not be long before there will be none of us left and I think a good perspective of events will dissapear.My findings, feelings and logic may not help but that will most likley not slow me down. Bruce looks at some of us as Kennedy lovers and in order to understand that you need basic information of the mentality of people at that time. The reason the conspirxcy worked so well is because the American people and a lot of the world trusted government and looked at Kenedy as the great white hope for the world.Human nature is to look for the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow or the Robin Hood effect.

[andries]

Well it is decided to be done,so it,s easy to decid now to stop the show,and open all files and relevant documents and admitting by forcing the right people who probably like to be forced to do so.Through the years it has grown so big that almost everybody knows that millions off people are being fooled in the name and for the good of uncle sam and the USAIt,s like the BERLIN WALL Gorby did not open it, he just smiled, but it was the people who did itHolland is known for free drugs,sex,a lot off heavy drinks and freedom off speech and less respect for authorities and media Wonder how far we would be if sutch happened in Holland. caracters like Spector or Bugliosi would never stand a change in holland

[Jsnow915]

I agree with Dealy Joe...I've spoken to alot of my elders (I'm 47...a year old in 63)...but there was alot of trust in the government and politicians before Kennedy...it took the Kennedy assassination to wake them up...as one person I asked (in his 70's)he said that people were niave and more innocent and more in touch with religion and compared to today,he doesnt trust anyone or anything now....what a shame.

[ThomZajac]

Yes, it was an "innocent" time. And it was the very early days of everyone having a television- a very powerful tool which enabled the wizards to manipulate and control the masses in ways that had never before been possible. The notion that the US government would want to kill its own president was a preposterous back then. We believed mightily in God and country, and we were naive as hell. Happily so. But we were VERY worried about nuclear annihilation.

[Dealey Joe]

I remember the greatest shock and awakening came in the fall of 1957.when all Americans still thought that the US was so far superior to the rest of the world.SPUTNICThen as we were coming to grips with that the space program started and calmed our fears a bit.And then the end of our illusionary world came on November 22, 1963

[tom jeffers]

stan,interesting points and i do not disagree with any of them.tom

[Bob]

Stan wrote:Michael Calder wrote:David Rockefeller decided to remove JFK by extra legal means and went to Allen Dulles to see if he concurred. He did. Allen Dulles is fired by JFK in Sept '62 and the plot is given to Richard Helms, DDP at CIA. Helms is the architect. Helms later murders RFK using his own creation, MKULTRA. Richard Helms is fired in 1973 by President Nixon yet Ford and Reagan have attempts on their lives. This is David Rockefeller once again using CIA to put his brother, the vice president into the oval office and later George Bush, the VP of President Reagan. It also means that CIA was co-opted by the economic elite and has been used ever since as it's own private security firm. Will CIA once again be used to strikedown a president under orders of the economic elite. What do you think? http://www.jfkcia.comI believe this is very close to what happened. The JFK murder came from the absolute pinnacle of power in the American Empire. Who was/is at that apex? There was never a chance of failure because they controlled the game. I think many researchers, especially those just starting out, become confused by all the different variables in this case. The Military Industrial Complex, the Mafia, Cubans, The CIA, Texas Oil. In reality, it is all owned, and that ownership is singular. This power has a very long tail that it wags. Who owns Wall Street and the Federal Reserve? Who controls the United States military? Who advances the American Empire through the use of Straw Boogey Men? There is one power source in the country. It is run by a small group of families that manipulate the political system and circumvent its effectiveness.Fletcher Prouty said each and every President has many enemies. There are many factions that would want to do him harm. But, the President is protected. In Kennedy's case, they removed his protection and allowed him to be murdered. This was not a coup d'etat in the classic sense. It was not a movement to seize power, but a movement to hang on it. JFK was getting ready to change the whole power structure and how the country did its business. RFK waited in the wings. Sixteen years of Kennedys would have changed the landscape of the American Empire. The true owners of the country were not going to stand back and allow all they had to be up-rooted. JFK had to go.Theorizing, it could have taken one conversation with David Rockefeller and Averill Harriman and/or Henry Cabot Lodge. Allen Dulles is brought in and quizzed, and the whole conspiracy is then set in motion. McGeorge Bundy, Mike Forrestal, Ed Lansdale and Averill Harriman were all key Rockefeller men on the inside. Read Donald Gibson's book "The Kennedy Assassination Cover-up." He details how the Warren Commission was quickly put into place by Walt and Eugene Rostow, Joseph Alsop and Dean Acheson. These men were from the Eastern Establishment, the true source of power that even wags the Texas Oil tail.Ultimately, Kennedy was murdered for money and power. The Rockefellers/Duponts/Morgans/Cabots/Lodges were not going to let Kennedy change the power they controlled.Shanet Clark has written and excellent essay on the Education Forum, "Was the Assassination of President Kennedy Legal":http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index ... 387Richard Helms, David Atlee Phillips, James Angleton, Ed Lansdale were not rogues (JFK was the rogue). They worked for the true source of power in the country. That source gave the order to remove John Kennedy from his office. These men were soldiers and did they jobs. The power of the decision was much higher: the American Corporate Empire. Figure out who owns this, and you know who killed JFK and why.EXCELLENT first post Stan! Welcome to the forum. Like Tom, I agree with everything said. Based on that post anyway, you are Stan the Man.

[ThomZajac]

The best initial post of all time!Thanks, Stan, I think you are absolutely on the money (and power).Thom