Clint Hill!

[Kit Carp]

Phil.Dont you think all three of those descriptions are completely different than the "book review" description, and that each puts the large wound in exactly the same place?Consider carefully where this location is at: "I see that his eyes were fixed and there was a large hole above the right ear, just to the REAR above the right ear about the size of my palm."Do a test for me. 1. Make a palm sized hole with the fingers of your right hand.2. Place it over your right ear.3. Raise this wound above the ear.4. Move the wound "just to the rear" a little bit.5. Look in a mirror. Where is this wound located?It's precisely in the spot all the doctors and nurses from Parkland were photographed showing it was. A person's head isnt that large. any wound of any good size above and even slightly rear of the ear is by nature going to be at least partly occipital, or, in the REAR of a person's head. It's nearly unanimous in all the testimony of all witnesses that this wound wasnt centered...it wasnt on the left. It was on the right, and the vast majority of physicians call this wound "occipital parietal", which is where Clint puts it every time.Now in that BOOK REVIEW- they leave out "TO THE REAR", which is what I was getting at. This completely changes the location of said wound.AND, it ISNT what Hill says in the book being reviewed!!!!He very clearly places the wound "in the rear of his head" without hedging and he calls it "fist sized" in the new book.I've read most, if not all of Clint Hill's testimony in the case...there isnt that much there, because he has seemed terribly reluctant to talk about it all these years. As far as I can recall, he has always been honest about just where that gaping exit wound was.I dont consider any of the three descriptions you site to Clint in different locations. It's true the wording feels less damning in feel in the one instance, to the WC case...but is it really? If the wound is above the ear...and TO THE REAR....it can only really be on one place, eh?I dont think CH buckled under. He likely was told to change his story, and told to stay with the car, but he kept to the rearward wound, and tried to get between the bullet and JFK as best he could. He's the ONLY Secret Service man that day who attempted to do his job.He may be guilty for not quitting the SS and screaming to the winds that Greer was at least incompetant, that his boss told him not to leave the car, but I'm not sure that is qualification for hating the guy. There isnt any proof that he knew what was up, and surely not all of the SS was involved in the assassination. I'm going to cut him some slack here, and keep him in the good guy column.That book reviewer, however, ought to be hung.

[kenmurray]

I'm not giving Clint Hill slack. He is going along on TV promoting Gerald Blaine's book. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmcbRdd- ... re=related

[Phil Dragoo]

Here is the top authority on the Secret Service in his own words.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwym9AIW ... ed~~~Clint Shill says three shots from behind all hit their mark; pay no attention to the cottage industry pushing conspiracy theories.I say, Clint, you were drinking then, you're drinking now, you're so full of shit, you squish when you walk.Gerald Blaine and Clint Shill bleat that “there's nothing we could have done”--that's an entire hog confinement manure pit.Agents always rode on the back of the limo, except in Dallas.Agents were barred from drinking til three a.m.--yet Clint and the boys were in Rubyville pouring it down.Emery Roberts pulled the agents off the back—not JFK.The motorcycles—drastically curtailed on orders of the Secret Service—not JFK.The route—selected for a crossfire kill-zone—with Secret Service collusion.Greer brakes for snipers—it's on his bumper sticker.Elmer Moore badgered Perry to back off the throat entry wound—and Elmer Moore is the Secret Service agent who spoon-fed the Commission and called JFK a traitor.The Secret Service stole the body, sanitized the limo, manipulated the autopsy and the photos and x-rays.This is a half-century cya book.These two will burn in hell for eternity.Oh, and Doug Horne reports the Secret Service destroyed its records for 1963 rather than give them over to the archives as they were required to do by the JFK Records Act.Vince Palamara and Doug Horne say the Secret Service got some 'splainin' to do.They could start by walking back the lie that JFK said to remove the agents from the back of the limo—Vince has an enormous amount of evidence showing that is an obscene act of guilty survivors—I say, conspirators.If they're so damned proud of their actions, why did they destroy their records.Craven traitors.http://vincepalamara.blogspot.com/

[Davyjones]

Hate to say this. BBC4. The Uks top radio station.9 million reach,had Clint Hill on this morning plugging his book. You can all get it on BBCiplayer until tomorrow. He is a bad boy,he says he only heard 2 shots and they came from the TBD! He was not challenged. The spot was at 8.20am UK time.

[kenmurray]

A review of "The Kennedy Detail" by Vince Palamara:http://www.ctka.net/reviews/kennedydetailreview.html

[Phil Dragoo]

Nice catch, Ken. Vince Palamara: 16,930 choice words for Gerald Blatant and Clint Shill—and not one of them obscene or profane: a master of self-restraint.I am not so forgiving.I don't really see the point of Jim DiEugenio spending a paragraph disclaimer on Hersh when it warrants a single mention in Palamara.The crux of the cookie is that Judas Blatant writes a book around a fictional meeting November 25, 1963, survived by no attendee save himself.That the fool on the Hill cannot see the blatant lie that there were three shots all finding their mark—despite Warren and Tague, not to mention reason, evidence, and truth.Palamara has been a true and faithful servant—with only a brief lapse of insanity crediting Bugliosi's cinder block of compressed manure.Vince makes these points which I find cogent and compelling:Curtailing of motorcycle coverage—by Secret Service.Agents off the rear—not by JFK, though Secret Service continues this lie.McHugh out of front seat position—part of the plot.Burkley bumped from back-up or lead car—insidious intention.Photo car pushed back out of camera range—part of massive media blackout.Sheriff Decker orders deputies to sit on thumbs—wrong in so many ways.Mil intell cancelled—by “anonymous voice from Washington”--yes, but they were there as 488th members of DPD, doing dirty deeds dirt cheap.Will Fritz' cannon car excluded.Rooftops naked—save for the county mounty with the Sabot on Records--”I shoot lots of people”--with a nice new silencer.Greer's “I brake for snipers” routine—this ass should have been drawn and quartered, given the Full Roselli.Blatant and Shill—hey, enjoy your thirty pieces of silver, gents. It will burn a hole in your palm soon.

[Kit Carp]

My apologies, Phil, if I got you riled up a bit. I know I am often very opinionated, and the internet offers no way for subtlety of tone and approach.My point was that Clint Hill, while he has really said very little since the assassination, has always consistantly placed the exit wound on the rear of JFK's head. Here, out of Palamara's review of Blaine's book of blame pointing, is the specific quote from Hil that I was talking about earlier in the thread, which I expect Hill provided directly, since he was involved writing the book's forward. Clearly it is one of the real honest to goodness pointers towards conspiracy in Blaine's book.Note how completely different this description is, than the "book reviewer's" supposed "quote" from the review Tom posted on page 2 of this thread, which puts the wound in an entirely different part of JFK's head.***Palamara-"On page 217, Blaine writes that agent Clint Hill saw “a bloody, gaping, fist-sized hole clearly visible in the back of his head,” clear evidence that JFK was struck by a shot from the FRONT, as also confirmed by Hill’s report113 and Warren Commission testimony114, not to mention the reports (plural) from fellow agent Paul Landis (whose contents were confirmed by Landis to the HSCA)115, no matter what Landis or Blaine say now (see pages 225 & 352-353), as well as the statements made by agent Sam Kinney to Vince Palamara116 (and, ironically, in Blaine’s own book, pages 216 & 218, regarding blood hitting his windshield!) and agent Win Lawson, who also “saw a huge hole in the back of the president’s head.”117 Blaine also uses this same language later in the book (page 258):Now the men who just four and a half hours earlier had seen the back of President Kennedy’s head blown off hauled the casket holding his dead body...” Finally, regarding Hill, Blaine describes his friends’ recollections of the autopsy (page 266): “Six inches down from the neckline, just to the right of the spinal column, there was a small wound, a hole in the skin... All Clint could see was that the right rear portion of President Kennedy’s head was completely gone."***As to Greer, Roberts and the others that Palamara finds suspicious, and Kellerman, who Horne suspects...I am all aboard with those assessments. Those are the guys who are guilty of terrible crimes, of treason.In my opinion Hill is guilty of drinking the night before, but he at the very least attempted to put himself between the bullets and the Kennedy's without any regard for himself....which none of the other agents even attempted to do.He is no more guilty of not going to the press and screaming conspiracy than Jackie, or Robert, or Powers or O'Donnell...in my opinion. All of them could have, but chose not to. That's just the cold, hard facts. If we want to damn people for not acting...how can we choose to damn some, but not all?In Hill's case, he may have the same conservative blindness as those two FBI agents, Sibert in O'Neill. I find their ARRB testimony enlightening as to the attitudes and complacency towards our government that is of a different generation....one less questioning and more trusting of authority.Sibert and O'Neill saw the same things as Hill. The rear head wound, the low shoulder wound. They wrote about Humes decrying surgery to the head. They wrote about a "missle" being found, and knew no back to neck trajectory was discussed at the autopsy. They even interviewed Greer and Kellerman later on, which was odd, as if they were suspected of something.Yet, before the ARRB, they express hatred for Arlen Spector, they are angry the WC never included their report or properly interviewed them......but they still seem to honestly believe Oswald acted alone.They believe this because they have accepted what was told to them, and think people crying conspiracy are just liberal troublemakers. For that reason, they shy away from those books touting conspiracy...and God help us, if we listen to the media about the case.I think it's important that we, as serious researchers, understand that this state of mind existed then, and how that got in the way of the truth...with almost everyone.It does not neccesarily mean Sibert and O'Neil were traitors or that they were incredibly stupid. Same goes for Hill, in my book.Anyways, that's my two cents on this CH issue.

[Bob]

I know what JFK would say to the Secret Service..."Et tu?"

[kenmurray]

Who's telling the truth: Clint Hill or the Zapruder Film?By Jim Fetzer:http://jamesfetzer.blogspot.com/2011/01 ... ll-or.html