The De Mohrenschildt's

[Tommy Wilkens]

In the early summer of 1974 Willem Oltmans had recorded in his personal notes of a chilling conversation he had with both George and Jeanne De Mohrenschildt.It's recorded notes like this that let us see the real De Mohrenschildt's and there dark side .Oltmans recorded that the three had spoken about Richard Nixon and Jeanne with a very dark and sullen look said “Seems there's no one prepared to shoot Nixon” In a quick reply George says “that's the remarkable difference between a soldier who will shoot and kill for a cause or an ideal and a murdering killer who will be hired and payed to kill. The anti Castro Cubans were prepared and murdered John Kennedy in Dallas without ever asking one penny for it .

[Randy Bednorz]

It's interesting -- today -- that people like Jesse Ventura are pointing up deMohrenschildt's ties to both Bush-41 and Oswald, but fails to mention Phillips -- who, by my reckoning -- also ties together Bush and Oswald.It mystifies me that Ventura never mentioned the Phillips angle. For me, the Phillips angle is a sure thing. I reject all theories that don't put him near the center.So if Ventura says deMohrenschildt was "Oswald's CIA handler," and declassified documents explain Oswald's "re-assignment" to Phillips in 1961, which story is more relevant?Phillips -- among Bush, deMohreschildt and Oswald -- was the only "CIA careerist." There is no real obstruction to the idea that Oswald had more than one "handler" at the same time.Usually, or quite often, when I examine "Letters to the Editor" in the local paper, there is this simplistic assumption that an effect can have only one cause. This leads to an argument that "it's either one or the other -- it can't be both."But of course -- it can be both . . . "all three" . . . several.

[Tommy Wilkens]

Very well said Randy...I totally agree Phillips was involved up to his eyeballs and above.From what I read into Ventura is that he is a late comer on this subject.He has done some interesting hands on work concerning President Kennedy's assassination.But most it seems are handed to him and he is like a mouth piece that has some clout to bring it out to the public.I don't know how deep his study is on the subject.This whole thing is such a spider web it's hard to tie all the ends up together.But I do know first hand that George De Mohrenschildt was involved in the planning stages of President Kennedy's assassination.My wife and myself have made 4 trips to Den Haag in The Netherlands and made an in depth study of the Willem Oltmans Archives and with our own eyes have held and read the personal hand written letters and notes sent to Willem Oltmans from George De Mohrenschildt that point blank tell of his direct involvement. We are in the process of bringing all our research into manuscript form and will at the right time publish and bring our findings out for the public.We are in contact right now as I write this posting with a Dutch publishing company that has shown interest. Could we find a publisher in the USA ?? Who knows but from experience it could prove difficult. But on the other hand European publishing companies are much more likely to not hide the truth out of fear. And once published in Europe it will be just a matter of time before it makes the big haul across the big pond!!!!! Keep adding to the Forum Randy I value your postings and have found them all to be very informative and helpful....

[Randy Bednorz]

It's interesting that in the quoted remarks you gave, they attempt to clarify and expand the Lone Nut myth.As to the publication angle. There were several people who simply couldn't find a US book publisher.Fonzi was one of them. The other was Claudia Furiati, with her "ZR/RIFLE" book.Maybe you'll get lucky. Furiati said she went to some ten different publishers.

[Tommy Wilkens]

NO NO NO Randy very far from that .In the Oltmans archives there are also letters from George De Mohrenschildt saying Oswald was directed how to set the plot up,and to not be a shooter. Was Oswald involved ? YES.Did he shoot anyone on November 22,1963 NO. And that's why we see him so distraught when in police custody. That's why the phrase "I'm Just a Patsy" was telling the truth.Everything points right to this,test's proving he shot no rifle that day, Voice Stress analyzer showing his words were true.The time line of exiting the 6th floor that couldn't be done. I have only released a small portion of our findings to this Forum.Why all we found is tucked and hidden under lock and key all the way over in The Netherlands for the life of me is a mystery to me .The material is there. I have seen it with my own two eyes.

[Tommy Wilkens]

I also meant to address the publishing of our manuscript that you mentioned. Our manuscript and study isn't out to prove who killed John Kennedy.Our goal is to tell the story of what this Dutch journalist Willem Oltmans uncovered in his ten year long investigation and his close intimate friendship that he had with George De Mohrenschildt. And to show how the discrediting machine here in the United States went into full steam once he came forward with his findings.It's a story that needs to be told. It's a story that has been deeply buried away now for way to long. Once the 1500 bound notebooks that held Oltmans personal notes and files were brought out for us to study there was no doubt in our minds what so ever of what we had found. We interviewed Dr. Ad Leerinfelt the Curator of Modern Day Manuscripts at the Dutch Royal Library who was a personal friend of Willem Oltmans and was present at Oltmans deathbed when he bequeathed his files and records to The Dutch Royal Library and said there that day maybe one day if the files and records and notes are preserved someone will come and take a second look at his work and his findings. Well we are that someone and we took a second look and did a deep study of his files and records and notes and now can bring this long hidden story to the general public.

[Randy Bednorz]

Tommy Wilkens wrote:NO NO NO Randy very far from that .In the Oltmans archives there are also letters from George De Mohrenschildt saying Oswald was directed how to set the plot up,and to not be a shooter. Was Oswald involved ? YES.Did he shoot anyone on November 22,1963 NO. And that's why we see him so distraught when in police custody. That's why the phrase "I'm Just a Patsy" was telling the truth.Everything points right to this,test's proving he shot no rifle that day, Voice Stress analyzer showing his words were true.The time line of exiting the 6th floor that couldn't be done. I have only released a small portion of our findings to this Forum.Why all we found is tucked and hidden under lock and key all the way over in The Netherlands for the life of me is a mystery to me .The material is there. I have seen it with my own two eyes.WHoa! That's a horse of a different color, and I misunderstood what you were saying. deM__________t died under suspicious circumstances. If those notebooks you cite were taken before that -- I assume so [and how else could it be?] -- then it could be a real windfall that will add a very big crack to the old Lone-nut myth.The only issues to address include "are these documents real?" and simply the fact that they have a hearsay dimension for being interview notes of some kind. Likely, there shouldn't be an issue with the first question, and I'm only now becoming familiar with this -- it draws from HSCA testimony. Moreover, it was unpublished HSCA testimony!!http://www.history-matters.com/archive/ ... ny.htmThus, the material presaging your own document investigations would not even have become public until the ARRB hearings in the 1990s.My own modest discoveries were "printed" matter slipped through the CIA vetting process. Because the material embedded in those publications is -- first of all -- sparse to avoid outright detection by readers, and second -- includes both memoir and fiction genres -- people will attack it on those grounds. But it's also "first hand" -- as much as a confession from the author.I don't remember the precise year that deM_______t died (shotgun lead-poisoning) -- it might have been either 1978 or 1979, but now I see -- Oltmans might have obtained a lot of paper artifacts since he initially sought to interview deM_____t around 1968. Yes! This should be "quite a find!" I almost want to ask you questions at this point about "social-network degrees-of-association" with other "persons-of-interest."

[Tommy Wilkens]

Thank you Randy and glad we are back on the same page. George De Mohrenschildts death was stranger than strange. In our investigation and research dealing with his death on March 29,1977 we found some strange happenings that went on that day. After corresponding with Mark Lane who said De Mohrenschildts death should be looked into and the Palm Beach County's Coroners inquest was questionable at the least !!! He said he was glad our investigation was looking into it. We set out to find that cassette recording of the moment a shot gun blast is recorded on tape .We hunted far and near went to every agency in the state of Florida , The Palm Beach County Sheriffs Office ,the Palm Beach County Coroners Office , the Florida State Attorneys Office ,The Manalapan Police Department ,The Palm Beach County Court System,The Florida Attorney Generals Office, The FBI. NO ONE not one agency could find or locate that recording that was used in the Palm Beach County Coroners Inquest .We were finally notified by the State Attorneys Office that the tape had been destroyed .If anyone can believe such a thing . Now what we did find and locate was an individual who was present the day the tape was played in open court in the Death inquest hearing .Our contact said the strange beeping sounds that came from the house alarm system that went off several moments before the gun blast is heard wasn't the only strange thing about that recording. Our contact said it was very plain to hear on the tape shoe foot steps on the hard wood floor just moments before the blast. So we located the actual death scene pictures taken that day March 19,1977 in the Tildon home and there was George De Mohrenschildt sitting very much dead in a high backed chair with nothing on his feet but socks.And the pictures showed many angles of the entire small sitting room and no were in sight are there any shoes what so ever. Our contact stated that you hear shoe footsteps right up to the gun blast. Now another strange thing our investigation turned up .That evening at the Palm Beach County Sheriffs Office switch board a call came in from an unidentified person who gave information to the switch board operator concerning the De Mohrenschildt death who thought it was important enough to safe for further investigation.We couldn't find a word of that either and no one would help either. Now one last thing concerning this part of our investigation. We located and insider at the Palm Beach County Coroners Office who we contacted and they offered us assistance in locating the tape recording and anything else they could uncover for us .It wasn't a full week until we were notified by our contact that they had been warned if they continued in there search concerning this case there job would be in jeopardy. Which left us to believe a cover up is still in place and going on .We have been told in our investigation that there are several copies of the death tape in the hands of private individuals around the country but so far we are unable to locate even a copy.

[Randy Bednorz]

Couldn't help but check your facts about the so-called "suicide." Yes -- 1977. You didn't need to do it, but you forgot to mention that he'd received Fonzi's business card just the previous day (maybe sooner?)So -- darn right! -- it was suspicious. Just as the "heart-attack" death of Dave Morales seemed suspicious -- also slated to appear at HSCA hearings. Or Nagell's death, a few days before he was supposed to appear before the ARRB in the early 1990s. Then, we have texts of correspondence with GHWB-41 -- "Mr. Rubbers" -- the text dealing specifically with Warren testimony. The history I scanned today mentions a Dallas CIA careerist [or possibly FBI] J. W. Moore in direct contact with deM_________t. Let us assume -- not from the perspective of the historian, but from that of criminal investigation -- an extremely high probability that Rubbers had contact with Dave Phillips. [ I argue that "Phillips says so."] We KNOW deM______t connected to Bush. Was there ever any solid document or evidence that DeM_______t had direct contact with Phillips?DiEugenio and others have disparaged the value of "social network analysis" __ degrees of association -- in attempts to expand the roster of "conspirators." That is, deEugenio -- in things he's written -- might make an understandable but over-reaching assumption that such an analysis would encourage more "conspiracy-a-go-go" with unsound judgments of culpability being passed off as "history."My primitive use of it was intended to show how Phillips connected to certain literary figures (i.e., Richard Condon) going back to 1953, to Condon and Hemingway in Havana 1954, to Robert Mitchum as early as 1957 (who had a period of frequent contact with Condon in the mid'50's.) Then there was the contact between Phillips' "propaganda shop in Building K" colleague "Len," who had a one-to-one relationship of correspondence with Condon (likely) going back to 1960.None of this was intended to label book authors, actors (except Phillips), screenwriters (like James Phillips), or directors like Frankenheimer -- as "conspirators." Instead, it was intended to show a "history of ideas" approach to the "design of cover-story and execution-plan" in the assassination.Anyone familiar with these incarnations of the same classical myth? "My Fair Lady," "Pygmalion," "Galatea?"Trivia question: How does that myth apply to "Manchurian Candidate" and the Oswald story?Phillips was a liberal-arts major -- well versed in these backgrounds.

[Tommy Wilkens]

Thanks for your great reply's Randy .I have noticed in every reply or post you make I always come away thinking deeply on what you have said. And because of that you are a great asset and member to this Forum.I am sure others here must feel the same.In my last post discussing De Mohrenschildts death I meant to also mention that yes investigator Fonzi was there looking for De Mohrenschildt only hours before the death took place.And another strange occurrence was that there were at least five people and I am not including Bill O Reilly's claim that he was on the Tilton's front door step when the shot gun blast went off.I personally thing that is a lie and a big LOAD of BS. But there was at least five people present either in the Tilton house or very close outside the house and no one heard the 20 gauge shot gun blast .That seems very strange to me .Another point of what seems strange to me is George supposedly placed the shot gun barrel in his mouth and pulled the trigger. In the death scene photos and the autopsy report which we have it shows no exit wound in the top of the head or anywhere on his head.And finally the lead investigator from the Palm Beach County Sheriffs Office was quoted as saying there investigation was 99% sure the death was due to suicide.In my mind that leaves a window open that the death could indeed have been something other than what we have been told.Our inside source at the Palm Beach County Coroners Office said from what they could see that De Mohrenschildt file and case is wrapped up as tight as anything they had ever seen there even after all these years !!!!!!