hy everybody!
i am new on this site, and i have got to say that i am really impressed! you all know so much about JFK. i started to get interessed in the live of JFK when i was about 15 years old and now i am writing a profile paper on this subject. well, that's not totally true, i am writing a profile paper on two subjects, and i am trying to compare them. i am hoping you can help me.
i am trying to compare the lives and deaths of two world leaders; JFK and Julius Caesar. really, if you look closley, you will find a lot of things which has happend to both of them. women, for example. and then of course, their death.
i have already been in contact with Mr. Dankbaar and he has told me both men have died because of the betrail of the ones who were supposed to protect them.
i would like to hear other reactions or thoughts or suggestions. really anything is welcome!
well, i hope to hear from you soon!
jessine
PS: i hope that the writing is good..
compairing two world leaders
Welcome to the forum jessine. Very interesting comparison. JC at least was able to confront one of his betrayers at the end with his now classic "Et tu Brute? " line. Unfortunately, JFK never had a chance to confront those who murdered him as he was killed instantly. That's why it's so important that we at this forum continue to confront those who were responsible for this crime, especially those that are still alive. Et tu Poppy?
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Nerrilyn Diefenbach
- Posts: 19
- Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2019 8:23 pm
What an interesting comparison Jessine! Probably the two most obvious similarities are the two you mentioned: they were both betrayed by those they trusted and who should have protected them, and they both liked to sleep with other men's wives. Otherwise i don't see a lot of similarities but i don't claim to be an expert on Julius Caesar by any stretch of the imagination. For what it's worth these are my thoughts.
Caesar's father died when he was in his teens. JFKs father outlived him, was a huge influence on him and was very active in determining and shaping his career. Caesar governed like a dictator and rarely listened to advice. JFK seemed to know his limitations and actively sought advice from those around him. Caesar was aggressive and war like. JFK preferred peaceful solutions to conflicts. Both men lived life at a fast tempo but where Caesar possessed physical vigor, JFK's health was extremely poor. Caesar is often referred to as a genius, with a will of steel and great brain power intellectually, militarily and politically. As fond as I am of JFK, in my opinion he was far from being a genius. However, there are others on the forum who would disagree with me on that point.
Apparently Caesar was a brilliant speech maker and this can also be said of JFK. Many of his speeches were inspiring and there was something about his delivery as well as the content that really grabbed you and made you truly believe what he was saying. Of course he had a speech writer, but I believe he was too much of an intellectual not to have had input into his speeches and he certainly delivered them in an inspiring way.
Finally, they both came from upper class backgrounds but although he was loved and respected by his troops as a great leader, Caesar did not seem to have JFKs gift of winning the affection of the average man in the street. Caesar was feared and respected but JFK was loved (or hated).
Hope your project goes well.
Nerrilyn
Caesar's father died when he was in his teens. JFKs father outlived him, was a huge influence on him and was very active in determining and shaping his career. Caesar governed like a dictator and rarely listened to advice. JFK seemed to know his limitations and actively sought advice from those around him. Caesar was aggressive and war like. JFK preferred peaceful solutions to conflicts. Both men lived life at a fast tempo but where Caesar possessed physical vigor, JFK's health was extremely poor. Caesar is often referred to as a genius, with a will of steel and great brain power intellectually, militarily and politically. As fond as I am of JFK, in my opinion he was far from being a genius. However, there are others on the forum who would disagree with me on that point.
Apparently Caesar was a brilliant speech maker and this can also be said of JFK. Many of his speeches were inspiring and there was something about his delivery as well as the content that really grabbed you and made you truly believe what he was saying. Of course he had a speech writer, but I believe he was too much of an intellectual not to have had input into his speeches and he certainly delivered them in an inspiring way.
Finally, they both came from upper class backgrounds but although he was loved and respected by his troops as a great leader, Caesar did not seem to have JFKs gift of winning the affection of the average man in the street. Caesar was feared and respected but JFK was loved (or hated).
Hope your project goes well.
Nerrilyn
thanks so much for your replies!
bob, i have got to ask, who is Poppy? I am still learning a lot about JFK, but i do not know everything and although i have searched, i cannot seem to find someone who is reffered to as 'Poppy'..?
Nerrilyn, i do have another similaritie though. both Caesar and JFK have an interesting military background. Caesar has led his men a lot of times into victory and was considerd as a military hero and even rewarded for is achievements. If i am correct, JFK had done something heroïc to. he has saved his men from a terrible death when his PT (some kind of ship) was overrun by another ship. I have heard that, although a lot of this story is true, it has been blown up by the media with a little bit of help from Joe Kennedy. so I am trying to figure out what is true. is JFK a military hero, or is this whole story just another misunderstanding, or even a lie?
again, thanks for your help, both of you, and i hope to hear from you soon!
Jessine
bob, i have got to ask, who is Poppy? I am still learning a lot about JFK, but i do not know everything and although i have searched, i cannot seem to find someone who is reffered to as 'Poppy'..?
Nerrilyn, i do have another similaritie though. both Caesar and JFK have an interesting military background. Caesar has led his men a lot of times into victory and was considerd as a military hero and even rewarded for is achievements. If i am correct, JFK had done something heroïc to. he has saved his men from a terrible death when his PT (some kind of ship) was overrun by another ship. I have heard that, although a lot of this story is true, it has been blown up by the media with a little bit of help from Joe Kennedy. so I am trying to figure out what is true. is JFK a military hero, or is this whole story just another misunderstanding, or even a lie?
again, thanks for your help, both of you, and i hope to hear from you soon!
Jessine
jessine, Poppy would be George H.W. Bu$h. Here is a little history, taken from the George H.W. Bu$h section from this site...
George H.W. Bush failed to disclose his friendship with George De Mohrenschildt, a renowned oil geologist and Lee Harvey Oswald's best friend in Dallas. They knew each other since 1942, probably even longer, because in 1939 he went to work for Humble Oil, a company founded by Prescott Bush. In 1977, when De Mohrenschildt is located by investigators of the House Select Committee on Assassinations, who want to interview him, he allegedly commits suicide the following day. The last person to interview him on the day he died, is Jay Edward Epstein, a writer/historian and a known apologist for the Warren Report since day one. Epstein married a CIA agent and is the biographer of former CIA-director James Jesus Angleton, presumably in charge of Oswald's "defection" to Russia. Interestingly, Epstein is also the "consultant" that was suddenly hired by NBC in 1995, when NBC was making a program for national TV on the confession of James E. Files. The program was promptly cancelled. In De Mohrenschildt's address book a telephone number is found for Bush's oil company Zapata Petroleum, with a further entry for "George Poppy Bush". It is well known that "Poppy" is a nickname for George H.W. Bush to his friends and family. Shortly before, De Mohrenschildt had sent his old friend George, now CIA director, a letter, asking if something could be done about the surveillance and harassment he was lately exposed to. Why would De Mohrenschildt suspect the harassment originated from the CIA? This letter is public domain now, but does not show up in the collections of correspondence that Bush put together in a book as a way of publishing his memoirs.
George H.W. Bush failed to disclose his friendship with George De Mohrenschildt, a renowned oil geologist and Lee Harvey Oswald's best friend in Dallas. They knew each other since 1942, probably even longer, because in 1939 he went to work for Humble Oil, a company founded by Prescott Bush. In 1977, when De Mohrenschildt is located by investigators of the House Select Committee on Assassinations, who want to interview him, he allegedly commits suicide the following day. The last person to interview him on the day he died, is Jay Edward Epstein, a writer/historian and a known apologist for the Warren Report since day one. Epstein married a CIA agent and is the biographer of former CIA-director James Jesus Angleton, presumably in charge of Oswald's "defection" to Russia. Interestingly, Epstein is also the "consultant" that was suddenly hired by NBC in 1995, when NBC was making a program for national TV on the confession of James E. Files. The program was promptly cancelled. In De Mohrenschildt's address book a telephone number is found for Bush's oil company Zapata Petroleum, with a further entry for "George Poppy Bush". It is well known that "Poppy" is a nickname for George H.W. Bush to his friends and family. Shortly before, De Mohrenschildt had sent his old friend George, now CIA director, a letter, asking if something could be done about the surveillance and harassment he was lately exposed to. Why would De Mohrenschildt suspect the harassment originated from the CIA? This letter is public domain now, but does not show up in the collections of correspondence that Bush put together in a book as a way of publishing his memoirs.
thanks a lot Bob! so you believe that Bush is the real murderer, or at least has conections with those who have shot JFK?
i have to say, it is so hard to figure out who is telling the truth. now that i know this, can i still consider the mob as conspiriters? and did james files knew about Bush?
thanks!
Jessine
i have to say, it is so hard to figure out who is telling the truth. now that i know this, can i still consider the mob as conspiriters? and did james files knew about Bush?
thanks!
Jessine
jessine, take some time to read through the George H.W. Bu$h section on this site. Also take a look at the JFKII video also available on this site. I believe it will enlighten you. In terms of your question regarding the relationship of Jimmy Files and Poppy Bu$h, I believe this will answer your question...
Jim Marrs : During that time, during the time of the Bay of Pigs, while you were training and moving around in the Caribbean, No Name Key and all that, did you ever hear the name George Herbert Walker Bush? James Files: Oh Yeah! Jim Marrs: What was his role? James Files: George Herbert Walker Bush. I don't know if, I think a lot of people are not going to believe this, but he worked for the CIA back as early as 1961 that I know of. Jim Marrs : How did he work? What did he do? James Files : I don't know all he did, but he did a lot of recruiting work. I know he was there at the beginning for what we called Group 40, a special operations group, Group 40. If you wonder what Group 40 was, an assassination group. Operation 40 was a top secret CIA project to train selected cuban exiles in guerrilla warfare and assassinations, aimed against the Castro regime. Apart from Felix Rodriguez, other members were now infamous CIA agents and Anti Castro terrorists like Luis Posada Carriles, Orlando Bosch, Guillermo and Ignacio Novo Sampoll and later Watergate plumbers Frank Sturgis, Eugenio Martinez, Virgilio Gonzalez and E. Howard Hunt. Most of the operation 40 members were recruited from JM/Wave, a much larger clandestine operation to train a cuban exile army for the Bay of Pigs invasion. JM/Wave is headed by CIA official Theodore Shackley. James Files, the confessed gunman on the grassy knoll, was recruited for the CIA by David Atlee Phillips on a recommendation of Ted Shackley. Shackley becomes George Bush's deputy director for Covert Operations in 1976. The CIA controller of JFK's assassin is provably close to Shackley, Shackley is provably close to Bush. Not significant?
Jim Marrs : During that time, during the time of the Bay of Pigs, while you were training and moving around in the Caribbean, No Name Key and all that, did you ever hear the name George Herbert Walker Bush? James Files: Oh Yeah! Jim Marrs: What was his role? James Files: George Herbert Walker Bush. I don't know if, I think a lot of people are not going to believe this, but he worked for the CIA back as early as 1961 that I know of. Jim Marrs : How did he work? What did he do? James Files : I don't know all he did, but he did a lot of recruiting work. I know he was there at the beginning for what we called Group 40, a special operations group, Group 40. If you wonder what Group 40 was, an assassination group. Operation 40 was a top secret CIA project to train selected cuban exiles in guerrilla warfare and assassinations, aimed against the Castro regime. Apart from Felix Rodriguez, other members were now infamous CIA agents and Anti Castro terrorists like Luis Posada Carriles, Orlando Bosch, Guillermo and Ignacio Novo Sampoll and later Watergate plumbers Frank Sturgis, Eugenio Martinez, Virgilio Gonzalez and E. Howard Hunt. Most of the operation 40 members were recruited from JM/Wave, a much larger clandestine operation to train a cuban exile army for the Bay of Pigs invasion. JM/Wave is headed by CIA official Theodore Shackley. James Files, the confessed gunman on the grassy knoll, was recruited for the CIA by David Atlee Phillips on a recommendation of Ted Shackley. Shackley becomes George Bush's deputy director for Covert Operations in 1976. The CIA controller of JFK's assassin is provably close to Shackley, Shackley is provably close to Bush. Not significant?
you're right, i am sorry.
i just want to know everything right away, very unpatient, but i forget that first i have to learn a lot.
so thanks for the hands up, i will continue my reading process on JFK and Bush ect.
if i still have questions than, i will let you know!! but in the mean time, please keep sending your thoughts about this subject (compairing two world leaders) as your posts really helped me a lot!
tanks!
Jessine
i just want to know everything right away, very unpatient, but i forget that first i have to learn a lot.
so thanks for the hands up, i will continue my reading process on JFK and Bush ect.
if i still have questions than, i will let you know!! but in the mean time, please keep sending your thoughts about this subject (compairing two world leaders) as your posts really helped me a lot!
tanks!
Jessine
No need to be sorry jessine. I didn't mean to come off condescending. I applaud your efforts to learn more about this subject. There is still much more to learn...for all of us. I only wish more people had your attitude, as opposed to keeping their heads in the sand about what is really going on in this world. I am also sending along two links that will help you to better understand the modus operandi of the Bu$hes...
http://www.thepeoplesvoice.org/cgi-bin/ ... ath_part_1
http://www.thepeoplesvoice.org/cgi-bin/ ... ath_part_2
http://www.thepeoplesvoice.org/cgi-bin/ ... ath_part_1
http://www.thepeoplesvoice.org/cgi-bin/ ... ath_part_2
wow, thanks..
but i really did not think of it as condescending! it is a good thing that you must read for your self first, cause than you can come up with the most intelligent questions!
and i totally agree with you about the fact that it seems that people do not want to knwo what is going on in their world. sometimes it looks like they just do not care! of course, i am not an american, but i would be so angry if i found out that my gouvernment has been lying to me. it seems so strange that there are so few people who want to speak up.
but i really did not think of it as condescending! it is a good thing that you must read for your self first, cause than you can come up with the most intelligent questions!
and i totally agree with you about the fact that it seems that people do not want to knwo what is going on in their world. sometimes it looks like they just do not care! of course, i am not an american, but i would be so angry if i found out that my gouvernment has been lying to me. it seems so strange that there are so few people who want to speak up.