Will we ever know?
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Nerrilyn Diefenbach
- Posts: 19
- Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2019 8:23 pm
I’m optimistic that the truth will eventually come out, much more optimistic since finding this website. A lot of questions are being asked with the advent of the Bush regime and the Iraq war as to how this could all possibly come about. More and more people want answers. I have just read “The Fall of the house of Bush” by Craig Unger. It does a great job of explaining the Bush/neocon/Christian right connection and the Saudi-American relationship, but what I hadn’t realised was that Bush 41 was so much on the outside. This must be quite a humiliating time for him. I almost feel sorry for him. To have got as far as he did and then have Georgie cock up in such a humungous way must be devastating. Maybe this will push him over the edge and he’ll crack. It’s a matter of keeping the issues re the assassination alive and relevant and Wim is certainly doing an excellent job in that department. I’m sure there are other pockets of information that could crack if the right people get pissed off enough about what’s happening.
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Nerrilyn Diefenbach
- Posts: 19
- Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2019 8:23 pm
Hey Bob. I think there are quite a few old men like Poppy Bush with information re the assassination, reflecting on their lives and questioning their past decisions. It is the nature of growing old really isn’t it? I’ve done a lot more research about Johnson and I have no doubt now, that he was indeed heavily involved in all aspects of the assassination. All the evidence suggests that he was a very tortured man at the end of his life. I think he wanted to do good initially, but like many others was corrupted by power and greed. I wonder who he bared his sole to and what more there is to come out. I wonder who poppy bears his sole to, or Arlen Spectre or Teddy Kennedy or all those other old men.
I’ve always struggled with seeing the world in terms of black and white, good and evil. Would it were all that simple. In reading “The Fall of the House of Bush” the thing that frightens me the most is that neither the Christian right nor the neocons seem to base their decisions on reason or common sense. We have a president who justifies murder in the name of Christianity, and OBL who justifies murder in the name of Islam. Who is evil? Who is good? Use all the semantics you want, justify it any way you want this is really what it boils down to.
I wonder if a ‘no blame’ scenario might work…. an appeal to all those old men who are still out there who do have a conscience. Just tell us why. What were you thinking? Is this the way you thought it would all end? If you could go back would you do it all again? This wound has been festering for 44 years now and the infection has never been more obvious than it is now. It is positively septic.
Sadly, a younger generation of men has taken your place and you have taught them too well. And so the power corruption merry-go-round continues to turn, turn, turn.
I’ve always struggled with seeing the world in terms of black and white, good and evil. Would it were all that simple. In reading “The Fall of the House of Bush” the thing that frightens me the most is that neither the Christian right nor the neocons seem to base their decisions on reason or common sense. We have a president who justifies murder in the name of Christianity, and OBL who justifies murder in the name of Islam. Who is evil? Who is good? Use all the semantics you want, justify it any way you want this is really what it boils down to.
I wonder if a ‘no blame’ scenario might work…. an appeal to all those old men who are still out there who do have a conscience. Just tell us why. What were you thinking? Is this the way you thought it would all end? If you could go back would you do it all again? This wound has been festering for 44 years now and the infection has never been more obvious than it is now. It is positively septic.
Sadly, a younger generation of men has taken your place and you have taught them too well. And so the power corruption merry-go-round continues to turn, turn, turn.
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Pennyworth
- Posts: 2931
- Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2019 8:23 pm
Chuck.........
This article was taken from 'Harrelson' thread in case anyone overlookeed it....
Giancana, Sam and Chuck. Double Cross: The Explosive, Inside Story of the Mobster Who Controlled America. New York: Warner Books, 1992. 366 pages.
The dust jacket of this bestseller claims that this is "the first book to solve -- finally -- the sensational, hitherto unsolved mysteries behind the deaths of John F. Kennedy, Robert F. Kennedy, and Marilyn Monroe." Yes, the book is sensational. Yes, Chuck Giancana, the younger brother of "Mooney" Sam, spent his career at Mooney's side and was privy to his secrets. But no, there's nothing to work with apart from Chuck's recollections of Mooney's occasional blustering -- over a span of five decades -- about how he had ex-bootlegger Joseph P. Kennedy in his pocket, had worked with the CIA on secret missions in Cuba, the Vatican, the Middle East, and Southeast Asia, and had helped arrange the deaths of MM, JFK, and RFK.
The authors note that "too many important political revelations have gone unnoticed by the U.S. reader due to tedious journalistic research, which results, unfortunately, in tedious reading. Instead, the subject of Sam Giancana's life has been approached with every attempt to engage the reader -- to tell a good story -- while maintaining historical accuracy." But while it's true that neither Mafia bravado nor CIA subversion lend themselves to the footnoting that scholars and mainstream journalists demand, what this means, ultimately, is that we're still left looking for the corroboration that might help us rewrite our history.
ISBN 0-446-51624-4
Giancana, Sam and Chuck. Double Cross: The Explosive, Inside Story of the Mobster Who Controlled America. New York: Warner Books, 1992. 366 pages.
The dust jacket of this bestseller claims that this is "the first book to solve -- finally -- the sensational, hitherto unsolved mysteries behind the deaths of John F. Kennedy, Robert F. Kennedy, and Marilyn Monroe." Yes, the book is sensational. Yes, Chuck Giancana, the younger brother of "Mooney" Sam, spent his career at Mooney's side and was privy to his secrets. But no, there's nothing to work with apart from Chuck's recollections of Mooney's occasional blustering -- over a span of five decades -- about how he had ex-bootlegger Joseph P. Kennedy in his pocket, had worked with the CIA on secret missions in Cuba, the Vatican, the Middle East, and Southeast Asia, and had helped arrange the deaths of MM, JFK, and RFK.
The authors note that "too many important political revelations have gone unnoticed by the U.S. reader due to tedious journalistic research, which results, unfortunately, in tedious reading. Instead, the subject of Sam Giancana's life has been approached with every attempt to engage the reader -- to tell a good story -- while maintaining historical accuracy." But while it's true that neither Mafia bravado nor CIA subversion lend themselves to the footnoting that scholars and mainstream journalists demand, what this means, ultimately, is that we're still left looking for the corroboration that might help us rewrite our history.
ISBN 0-446-51624-4
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tom jeffers
- Posts: 442
- Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2019 8:23 pm
hello all,
as an accountant, i have little time but work this time of year. it seems a lot of people are waiting for the cia to release the the sealed documents as if they will reveal the players. I think that there is no true evidence that will clear everything up. there is no memo that will tell what happened. there might be a few clues but it will not matter. the cover story is like a snowball rolling down a hill. the lie keeps gaining momentum as time goes on. more players continue to die and soon nobody that was alive when it happened will be alive. look at any confessions from suspcted players in the past and at how they are analyzed. everyone fights and argues as to the reliability of the evidence. just like hunt's story, everyone thinks he was still playing counter espionage with his story. those who were major players would be similar to hunt in that their version would be questioned. hell us conspiracy (truth seekers) theorists cannot agree.
as an accountant, i have little time but work this time of year. it seems a lot of people are waiting for the cia to release the the sealed documents as if they will reveal the players. I think that there is no true evidence that will clear everything up. there is no memo that will tell what happened. there might be a few clues but it will not matter. the cover story is like a snowball rolling down a hill. the lie keeps gaining momentum as time goes on. more players continue to die and soon nobody that was alive when it happened will be alive. look at any confessions from suspcted players in the past and at how they are analyzed. everyone fights and argues as to the reliability of the evidence. just like hunt's story, everyone thinks he was still playing counter espionage with his story. those who were major players would be similar to hunt in that their version would be questioned. hell us conspiracy (truth seekers) theorists cannot agree.
Tom, I know what you are saying. But I think we will find out. Someday. But I wouldn't count on any help from the CIA. The Bu$h fingerprints are still all over that agency. Hunt told the truth in many respects with his deathbed confession, but he left out a lot of key information that would have hurt Hunt and his "friends". Wim has helped solve a lot of the puzzle. More pieces will come. But you are right Tom. The disinformation machine keeps churning with more and more bullshit specials on the History Channel or Discovery, or with books by Vincent Bugliosi. The MSM is part of the cover up as well. They are in bed with their masters. That's why the internet is so important. One day, somebody will give a REAL deathbed confession. Or somebody will finally just OWN up to crucial facts. Like Wim uncovered with Jimmy Files and Chauncey Holt. All I know is that I will always keep looking for more answers. They are out there.
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Pennyworth
- Posts: 2931
- Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2019 8:23 pm
Hello Tom ,
You could be right but I hope that you're wrong...time is kind for change...
Nobody is supposed to be above the law in a democratic society...we all will hope to see some indictments materializing; some class action lawsuits for conspiracy to commit murder;wrongful death suits.. We The People Of the United States V.S.-------;citizen's arrests if it can be done (I dont' know )
Hello Bob ,
The only viable tool we have for communicating is this one here; we will never see what we have produced, procured and discovered by this information which in turn has lead to beyond any reasonable doubt to be shown on the 6 O'clock news....
You could be right but I hope that you're wrong...time is kind for change...
Nobody is supposed to be above the law in a democratic society...we all will hope to see some indictments materializing; some class action lawsuits for conspiracy to commit murder;wrongful death suits.. We The People Of the United States V.S.-------;citizen's arrests if it can be done (I dont' know )
Hello Bob ,
The only viable tool we have for communicating is this one here; we will never see what we have produced, procured and discovered by this information which in turn has lead to beyond any reasonable doubt to be shown on the 6 O'clock news....
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tom jeffers
- Posts: 442
- Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2019 8:23 pm
my point was that even if someone came forward with a confession, there would be 20 others coming forward to debunk it. look at jimmy's confession. those people that know the WC was a bunch of BS cannot agree. what makes you think that will ever happen? the problem is that whoever comes forward at this point will be questioned as to what their motivation is. Some will say it is for money, some will say notariety, some will say to cover up the real story, etc. Anyone that played a part will have their own agenda for coming forward and it may or may not be for the good of restoring accuracy to history. Most of the players were on one side of the law or the other. Those on the side where jimmy was will not be deemed as reliable because of their background in crime. Those on the other side are more crooked but deemed to be "honest" and will always perpetuate the lie to preserve their name in history. I would love for it to happen but it already has.....IE jimmy's confession and everything that Wim has correlated with it. Look how it is viewed by the rest of the so called Truth Seekers.
They think Wim is just out to make a buck because he sells books and dvds. But go to any other website, and they have a ton of shit to sell and they are not questioned as to their motivation. Wim is a hero and he is considered a traitor. I am not trying to argue with you bob but I just do not see that this thing will ever truly "come to light" as well as being able to change what history has to say about it. even after house committee deemed the assassination was more than likely a conspiracy in the 70's, the history books still say oswald was a lone assassin. The same small group of people that have held power the last 150 years, will always write history the way they want it to be remembered. the internet is a great resource but we are too unorganized to make a difference. I like your thoughts bob but I am too pessimistic to believe it will ever happen.
They think Wim is just out to make a buck because he sells books and dvds. But go to any other website, and they have a ton of shit to sell and they are not questioned as to their motivation. Wim is a hero and he is considered a traitor. I am not trying to argue with you bob but I just do not see that this thing will ever truly "come to light" as well as being able to change what history has to say about it. even after house committee deemed the assassination was more than likely a conspiracy in the 70's, the history books still say oswald was a lone assassin. The same small group of people that have held power the last 150 years, will always write history the way they want it to be remembered. the internet is a great resource but we are too unorganized to make a difference. I like your thoughts bob but I am too pessimistic to believe it will ever happen.
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Pennyworth
- Posts: 2931
- Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2019 8:23 pm
bookcase...
I doubt if anyone involved is going to confess... .. a book and /or a lawsuit is the way to go...a funny thing about the internet is that we do not have any idea who is looking at this board ... maybe some one can help ...the ONLY way this murder is going to be resolved is by publishing the info we have compiled here into bookform, and seeing some lawsuits concerning this case to be materializing....